Clarifying the whole 'Jon only sounds good due to studio trickery' subject.

I meant that those bands were products pre-fabricated to be marketed to kids -- which is WHY their looks and dance moves mattered more than their singing ability!

We agree that auto-tune and this kind of effects can do a lot of things, like pitch correction, but not many others, for example the power of his voice.

So, Jon's problem while touring is both pitch (hit the right note) and power. When he is in the studio the problem is only the pitch, that can be corrected. To explain it better, while recording an album he has all the time to regain the lost power and try again and again the takes. Is that right...?

OK but no, they're marketed to teenagers and young adults (15-25), people from the same generation who can be led into thinking that it could be them under the spotlight instead of those bands. That's what today's K-pop is all about.


@It's my faith: yes.

I think a complete vocal rest would help Jon a lot -- especially since he's looking at two gigs in a row.

Now that he's done his press in Malaysia, he should just lock himself in his hotel room and not say one word until Saturday's sound check. And not drink or smoke, of course.


@Joysey: 15-25 may have been what they were aiming at, but I'd say what they was hit 12 - 17.

Could it be that most of his issues come from a wrong breathing technique? The guy sounds out of breathe in most of the songs. It's like he tries to sing with the same air that he'd use when talking. Don't know much about singing, but couldn't that also affect the "power" or "depth" of his voice?

Guitars are sounding great.

Good Post...

My question is, is Jon really that bad or did someone come to him and say, 'if you don't change the way you sing, you'll have no voice in 20 years'?

Yep! I wonder how he'll be able to do 2 gigs in a row when 1 is too much already! There's so much smog that he doesn't need to smoke, he should just open his window and breathe the air outside, it can't be worse than tar and nicotine!

I'd say the frontier is 18, legal age. 15 to 18 yo teenagers only have pocket money to spend on their favorite bands (i.e. not much) and they need adults to drive them to shows (in most countries you can't have a driver's license until 18 yo).
18-25 can have a job, money and a car of their own, they're independent and spend a lot of money on their favorite bands, they're also more likely to collect everything they can find (cds, dvds, concerts, merch) and emulate the band members to escape their dull and lonely working life whereas schoolboys and girls just want to have fun and change their minds and musical tastes very often, according to trends.


Yes, of course, you can't sing properly when you don't breathe properly. I don't understand how a guy who does so much running can be so out of breath and power. Gotta blow up a balloon everyday, Jon!
He once went to see the 80s famous voice coach Katie Agresta but nowadays he's sounding like he forgot everything she taught him. His nasal tone is surely not Agresta's technique in any case. Actually it's more similar to Celine Dion's, it's what Europeans call "the American singing technique"!

"What are the benefits of nasality?
Nasality lowers the air pressure below your vocal cords. It helps you to balance your breath support and singing high notes become easier when you use a little nasality, especially when the notes need te be sung piano (with little volume)."

"Nasality often is used as a temporary technique to bring balance and reduce air pressure."
https://sites.google.com/site/vocalt...ty-good-or-bad

Agresta with Cyndi Lauper:
https://youtu.be/rKwX9QQwn8U?t=4m40s


Yep! If Richie's departure is the wake-up call that was needed to put more guitar in the songs then there's something positive about it after all.

Thanks to those with professional knowledge giving the rest of us insight. Obviously I had been giving Jon too much credit and believed that he had been doing vocal exercises and using vocal coaching etc. to no avail. If it is laziness, this is infuriating considering the time and money fans spend to go see this band. He once said that he liked songwriting the best and touring the least.

If he won't commit to improving, perhaps it is time to exit the arena stage and be a songwriter for others. Another poster elsewhere advised him doing acoustic shows on smaller stages but to me acoustic shows can accent vocal flaws that right now the smoke, mirrors and lights distract from.

I'm fully open to the idea that I am completely wrong on this, but:

I feel like Jon actually likes how he sounds now and, for him, "it's a good thing." He seems to take greatest pride in songs like "Reunion" and "Not Running Anymore." I'm basing this off his comments about those specific songs where he glows. I think he feels like 1995 Jon couldn't of sung those songs as effectively. I also felt there was some sense of satisfaction when he'd squeak his way through "Always" at the end of last tour: "look what I just did!" You could see it in his face. Sure he looked like he was dying the entire time leading up to that final moment, but when he got there? Nailed it.

I also feel like he probably lives in a bit of a bubble and doesn't know that pretty much anyone with an ear thinks he sounds terrible lately. People keep buying the albums, they keep buying the tickets: all is well. I do feel that it will take enough noise(ie, bad press, ticket sales, does he ever even look at message boards?) to get him to undertake a massive effort to improve his vocal condition.

On some level he has to know: he looks scared to death every time he sings a marginally challenging song. Yet, on another level, I think he's completely content and happy with where he is at.

Not true. There is only so much you can to a vocal using editing and pitch correction. You can't really change its tone (without making it sound like an effect).