Jon's Voice

Phil, if it was so simple and so easy, everyone would do it. Biochemistry is different for everyone. People who assume that they know what other people should or could do to conquer their problems are just ignorant (uninformed). I'm sorry, but you don't have a clue about battling your own body if you think change is so easy.

Also, I quit smoking over 3 years ago. The nicotine addiction is gone...but I still miss it sometimes and I do enjoy it. It's not just pure addiction that keeps you smoking...some smokers actually like smoking for what it is....particularly with alcohol or coffee.... and after a meal.

I never tried to imply it was extremley simple or easy, it is however very possible and to be honest, it's not that difficult to quit or change an unproductive behaviour, I'm living, breathing proof of that! So yeah, I know full well what it's like to change and conquer problems and with all due respect it's ignorant and very arrogant to make such an assercion.

There are many reason why people don't change, some I've already touched on, but many don't know these techiques or don't even know they exists so you can't blame anybody in that respect. I didn't know about these things until a few months ago but all I'm saying here is that there are answers and there are ways to help anybody change any unproductive behaviour. One thing I've learned in the last few years is that there are answers out there, even if you haven't yet found them, they are there. And anybody who's said they've tried everything and still not succeeded really are talking crap because if you truly did try everything you would have succeeded.



Phil

Exactly what did you overcome?

That I just said that it's not simple but at the same time it's not actually as difficult as most people think. Is it really that hard to see the difference?


Phil

Yeah.

Try some heroin...let us know how easily you quit when you do.

I can think of something makes perfect sense too LOL



Seriously, as BP said, one might not be addicted to the actual substance after a while (like a former heroin addict after their detox session of what a week?), that does not mean that person still doesn't battle addiction. It's silly to think the actual drug is what makes one addicted - it is not. Everybody can detox. Everybody can go without a cigarette for 3 days. Everybody can go without food for 3 days. The actual addiction stays. Ever heard of dry alcoholics? One might not drink anymore, but they are very much alcoholics.

Kryczek, whatever it was you spouted there about psychiatry and how to associate pain with the substance, that is the plain reason why people hate psychologists (though that is very different) and psychiatrists. That is exactly why so many addicts do not go to rehab, but try whatever it is themselves at home - their chance of battling their addiction is just as great than via an expensive rehab program. If you ever talk to people and truly find out what made them stop using, smoking, drinking, overeating, you'll find that it wasn't electro shock or the help of a psychiatrists. Those people recognized something in themselves that kept them from changing, those people found a way that worked for THEM --- and those things are different for anybody.

People that teach addiction should never be some professor who once gave up caffeine for a week and now spouts bs, it should be someone who actually did it themselves. Unfortunately, those people are rare, because true addiction is not curable and until the person dies sober, nobody is to say whether or not it worked!

A-****in-men

We were talking about smoking, not about heroine.
Just don’t take focking cigarettes to relax. People who can't quit smoking or pick up smoking a while after they quitted, are just weak.

Concerning that thing with breathing deeply- that’s like meditation, and it’s for sure that you’re totally relaxed when you meditate.

And hell yeah, the fact that he lets the audience down when he sings would pain him, and it probably already does.

It’s clear that Jon sings all songs in a low key nowadays, just because of the fact that he can’t manage to hit the high keys anymore. Did you guys notice that during ‘Livin’ on a prayer’ he never participates in the “wooooooohoooo” part anymore? He just lets the audience do that.

I loved Jon’s voice because of it’s vocal range and because it was so powerfull. Nowadays, it’s just boring and nothing special anymore.
“Is there a doctor in the house?”

It's true that Bryan Adams still has an awesome voice- just like Bruce Springsteen, who's pushing 60.

It's not the addiction that stays, it's the behavioural pattern that stays and the need to stay consistent with your self-imposed identity.

That's virtually exactly what I've been saying. The last thing I would ever advise anybody having any problems to do is see a physciatrist. They are without doubt the most dangerous therapists in the world because the principles on which their form of therapy is based goes against all the laws of how the brain operates. Let me ask you this, what's wrong with helping a person find that thing that helps them quit their habbit if they look for help?

Not exactly. I agree totally that it certainly helps if a therapist has overcome a unproductive behaviour himself because he can empathise with his patient, however, the person dosen't have to overcome a heroin addiction to help a person get over such a condition. If you have the knowledge, understanding and experience there's no reason why you shouldn't be able to help somebody.



Phil