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Thank You For Loving Me not written by Jon?

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  #1  
Old 04-16-2020, 08:56 AM
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Default Thank You For Loving Me not written by Jon?

Aloha !

I've been trying to put together a timeline when songs for the Jon's third solo record, Sex Sells and Crush were written and I feel something is off. There have been some questions in regards to It's My Life having been written by Bon Jovi or Max Martin, but I'm wondering how much of Thank You For Loving Me was written by Jon.

According to Jon, the song was written after seeing Brad Pitt say the line "Thank You For Loving Me." That movie however was released in november 1998, at a time Jon was filming for the all-time-straight-to-DVD classic Row Your Boat and wasn't focussed on writing songs at all as he's gone on record he rarely combined the two things. This would place the writing for the song somewhere in february, by the time shooting was done.

At that time period however, Westlife were recording for their debut album. I know that boyband never broke big in the U.S.A. but they were massive in large parts of the rest of the world. Their debut single, Swear It Again, was topping the U.K. charts roughly at the same time. And that song was written by Steve Mac and Wayne Hector, the same men who co-wrote Thank You For Loving Me. These men also wrote Flying Without Wings.


Follow up to these songs was What Makes A Man


If you had to wonder who wrote Thank You For Loving Me after hearing these two songs, would you mention Jon Bon Jovi?

When compiling the list of songs out there recorded either for Jon's solo project, Sex Sells or Crush it's obvious Jon's focus wasn't on writing ballads. There's only Stay, Thank You For Loving Me and Save The World. Both Stay and Save The World were written in 1997/1998 and then there's Thank You For Loving Me, sounding nothing like anything else the band had recorded up to that point.

I've no idea why Jon would have a writing session with these guys before the release of Westlife's record, both Mac and Hector had never had any major succes before Westlife. There would just have been no point in doing a session with 2 strangers with no previous succes. Steve Mac and Wayne Hector have never done any co-writing together with another artist which leads me to believe the majority of the song was written by Steve Mac and Wayne Hector and then Jon gave it a spin by adding his Thank You For Loving Me meet Joe Black idea to it.

Anyone else thinks this is plausible?

Salaam Aleikum,
Sebastiaan
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Old 04-16-2020, 09:32 AM
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Yeah sounds plausible.

I can’t stand West life probably the blandest boy band ever along with Boyzone , but probably explains why I can’t stand TYFLM.

Such a nothing song with rehashed lyrics. (These 5 words)


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Old 04-16-2020, 12:50 PM
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I don't think you're far off the mark at all. Songs get offered to band's all the time and that how Def Leppard ended up recording Long Long Way To Go from their X album in 2002 (also written by Wayne Hector). Def Leppard didn't take any writing credits on that one though. I think after She Don't Know Me Jon refuses to record a song that he isn't credited on. Maybe he changed a line here or there just to get it on there. But yeah, I don't think he sat down and write this with them at all. I think it was sent to him and he maybe tweaked it a little.
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Old 04-16-2020, 12:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Supersonic View Post
At that time period however, Westlife were recording for their debut album. I know that boyband never broke big in the U.S.A. but they were massive in large parts of the rest of the world. Their debut single, Swear It Again, was topping the U.K. charts roughly at the same time. And that song was written by Steve Mac and Wayne Hector, the same men who co-wrote Thank You For Loving Me. These men also wrote Flying Without Wings.
Ascap.com lists two writers for YTFLM, and these are JBJ & RS. BMI doesn't list the song at all, so not a case of credit split across publishers. I know they're listed on Wikipedia, but that's Wikipedia.

I'm not sure if you got insider info, or are insinuating that "but these sound so close, they should have gotten a co-write!", but officially, no, they did not.
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Old 04-16-2020, 01:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Alphavictim View Post
Ascap.com lists two writers for YTFLM, and these are JBJ & RS. BMI doesn't list the song at all, so not a case of credit split across publishers. I know they're listed on Wikipedia, but that's Wikipedia.

I'm not sure if you got insider info, or are insinuating that "but these sound so close, they should have gotten a co-write!", but officially, no, they did not.
That's interesting, I presumed from Supersonics post that they were credited on the album, but now you say it I do seem to remember is being listed as JBJ/RS. Strangely there doesn't appear to be any songwriting credits on Crush at all (at least the Vinyl and Promo CDs - I don't have the original CD handy).

Even the 7" doesn't list a song writer (the B-Sides Bed Of Roses does...which seems strange)
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Old 04-16-2020, 01:34 PM
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I remember having read these names on fan sites as far back as 15 years ago, I think the credits were either listed on the single or on one of releases (Japanese?), but the info about these two co-writers has been on the web for a long time. And even if they weren't listed on the album, it still seems like another spin on the Max Martin story.

I think, at that point, Jon and Richie had both lost the feeling for delivering a hit single and the record company had lost faith in them after both solo releases didn't really set the world on fire, especially in the US. Yeah, DA was successful in the UK and Germany, but in that era, Bon Jovi were at their absolute peak here and Jon was in the position to release almost anything and have it position itself well in the charts. And it taking on that Britpop feel helped as well. Don't get me wrong, I absolutely love that record, but the record company wanted either big ballads or extremly catchy pop-rock material to make the comeback happen.
So it seems very likely that they either teamed up Jon and Richie with successful pop song writers or had these writers send songs to the band to give them a bit of their own spin.
All the singles to follow up until Who Says were somewhere in that beaten pattern - Everyday and Have A Nice Day rehashed the IML theme and structure, All About Lovin' You was once again forced onto the album by the record company.
It's also obvious if Jon was proud of a song or not when looking at the setlists. In Europe, TYFLM was only played every 3rd of 4th night which was already odd given that the band's lead ballads were basically played every night night on their respective tours at first: Silent Night, Never Say Goodbye, IBTFY/Living In Sin, Bed Of Roses, Always, TAALS...
It showed up for a consecutive string of dates in late November in the US because that's when the single had just gotten released. After Japan 2001, the song wasn't to return at all on the tour anymore whereas even other album cuts such as Say It Isn't So, Two Story Town or Mystery Train still made the occasional appearance in 2001.
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Old 04-16-2020, 01:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thinny View Post
That's interesting, I presumed from Supersonics post that they were credited on the album, but now you say it I do seem to remember is being listed as JBJ/RS. Strangely there doesn't appear to be any songwriting credits on Crush at all (at least the Vinyl and Promo CDs - I don't have the original CD handy).

Even the 7" doesn't list a song writer (the B-Sides Bed Of Roses does...which seems strange)
The Crush album, as released, had no writing credits at all. Hell, it had no lyrics!

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Originally Posted by bonjovi90 View Post
I remember having read these names on fan sites as far back as 15 years ago, I think the credits were either listed on the single or on one of releases (Japanese?), but the info about these two co-writers has been on the web for a long time. And even if they weren't listed on the album, it still seems like another spin on the Max Martin story.
This is not about the album, this is about who is LEGALLY entered as having written the song. You can just opt not to print writing credits, sure, but you can't just change the legal information. Unless they had signed such a deal upfront, that they would not be credited. But why would Richie be credited then? Wiki just lists JBJ and these two guys.

I also remember Bob Rock being credited on a track on the Crush album. Never read that again. The writing credits for Crush are weird and disjointed, probably because they resulted from the songs having been written on a ton of occasions (two solo albums plus the writing period just for the "band album").

Quote:
All the singles to follow up until Who Says were somewhere in that beaten pattern - Everyday and Have A Nice Day rehashed the IML theme and structure,
If anything, Everyday sounds like N'SYNC's "Bye Bye Bye".

Quote:
All About Lovin' You was once again forced onto the album by the record company.
We know this because...? It's not a track that I don't see the band doing and merely HAVING to do because of the label. Speculation on this board is not the same as "that's how it was".
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Old 04-16-2020, 02:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Alphavictim View Post
We know this because...? It's not a track that I don't see the band doing and merely HAVING to do because of the label. Speculation on this board is not the same as "that's how it was".
Of course that's a rumour and not each of them is always true, but most have some truth to it that started it in the first place. And that one's been around since back in that day. I don't say they didn't write it, but I'm pretty sure they weren't keen on doing it and it merely was a compromise because there was no other "big ballad" that could've easily been released. It also feels kind of disjointed from the other ballds that the band did at the time, such as Postcards From The Wasteland, Joey, Open all Night or You Had Me From Hello. Jon was much more in that "Have A Littel Faith In Me"-kind of ballad mood at that time.
And at which other point did the band completely ignore their current single while on tour?
There has never been a full band performance and I seriously doubt that, hadn't it been for a drunk Richie in TV Total, it would have ever been played in 2003.
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Old 04-16-2020, 02:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Thinny View Post
I don't think you're far off the mark at all. Songs get offered to band's all the time and that how Def Leppard ended up recording Long Long Way To Go from their X album in 2002 (also written by Wayne Hector). Def Leppard didn't take any writing credits on that one though. I think after She Don't Know Me Jon refuses to record a song that he isn't credited on. Maybe he changed a line here or there just to get it on there. But yeah, I don't think he sat down and write this with them at all. I think it was sent to him and he maybe tweaked it a little.
That could've happened and either the label or Bon Jovi bought the rights to the song. All in that era was kind of a mess. In around 2000, there was an interview from a German reporter, Alex Gernandt, with Jon. That author had also published a German biography about the band and was quite close to them since the mid-80's after having had worked for various music magazines. I'm not sure if that quote was in Bravo magazine or in the book, but they had talked about IML and Jon jokingly said about Max Martin that "I didn't think it was such a good idea to be linked to one of the most famous pop writers on a rock record" and hence not having him in the credits.
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Old 04-16-2020, 04:19 PM
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I think this is the case of some sites having off information. Meet Joe Black came out in November 1998, if EdTV came out in March of 1999 Jon and Richie would have been writing together by that point so the timeline does match up.

I vaguely recall Richie talking about writing that song with Jon on a news segment. Personally I'd side with ASCAP over Wiki, unless printed proof exists with those song writers being involved.
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