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Litneg · #**771** 04-16-2021, 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Captain_jovi

His point was it tanked at country radio, that's a completely different point.

But yeah, the album tanked. He still thinks it did well which is just baffling.

Yeah, and that's sad, 'cause 2020 was a real good record

Captain_jovi · #**772** 04-16-2021, 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Litneg

Yeah, and that's sad, 'cause 2020 was a real good record

I'm of two minds of it tanking. A huge part of it tanked because the band's fan base has dwindled and they couldn't hide behind ticket sales inflating the numbers BUT it also got so little "real world" promo to anyone and I'd wager a lot of people didn't even know it was out.

People can scream all they want it failed because it was too topical/political, I'd say it failed because they're irrelevant. If it failed because it was too political there would have been backlash instead of silence.

James_86 · #**773** 04-16-2021, 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Litneg

Yeah, and that's sad, 'cause 2020 was a real good record

It really wasn't though. It was absolutely pants.

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liljovi93 · #**774** 04-17-2021, 12:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Captain_jovi

I'm of two minds of it tanking. A huge part of it tanked because the band's fan base has dwindled and they couldn't hide behind ticket sales inflating the numbers BUT it also got so little "real world" promo to anyone and I'd wager a lot of people didn't even know it was out.

People can scream all they want it failed because it was too topical/political, I'd say it failed because they're irrelevant. If it failed because it was too political there would have been backlash instead of silence.

I'm with you on this.

Nobody knows it was released. Lockdown prevented the usual promo. Whether we like The One Show etc or not, Jon going on it will spread 'some' word on the album. He went too early because of Invictus Games and then went too late when Story Of Love was released.

The singles that got released weren't songs I'd have as singles.

I didn't see any adverts this time round when usually I see a Bon Jovi advert on ITV for the new albums.

There's many reasons it 'tanked' and yeah, it did. But I also think it would have done a fair bit better if we weren't in the circumstances we are.

Jon's approach to promotion has been totally different and much more enjoyable this time around with everything that has gone on.

The latest podcasts have been more fun and interesting than anything in a long time. Yeah, we get the usual stuff for 85% of it but we always will.

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Rdkopper · #**775** 04-17-2021, 01:34 AM

Jon needs to stop with the Serious, Topical, Political, Newspaper, I'm too old to write Bad Name bullshit... and just write a fun catchy album that I can drive down the shore to.

Use studio vocal tricks to create some range and keep the same production used in 2020...

It's that ****ing simple

He also should have left the original 2020 album alone and never used those 2 new tracks to drive the album.

Beautiful Drug and Blood In The Water should have been the muscles behind it.

Captain_jovi · #**776** 04-17-2021, 02:14 AM

You can't really say "It's that simple" but also

".....Blood In The Water should have been the muscles behind it.

AND

"just write a fun catchy album that I can drive down the shore to"

Those are two polar opposite opinions. What do you mean? BITW is the definition of song you don't want.

semigoodlooking · #**777** 04-17-2021, 02:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Supersonic

Aloha !

The reason why this works for other bands is that other bands understand the admiration people have for their work. It's a pride both the band and its fanbase share. So bands are willing to share their passion by releasing things they feel is worthy of releasing. They understand why people love the old stuff because they feel the same pride.

Meanwhile Jon Bon Jovi's sole purpose of releasing music is to be able to go on tour to make money to buy a football team or be important at other stuff. Jon Bon Jovi doesn't care for the music he releases anymore. He says he's proud of it but once it tanks his opinion on it changes radically.

Fans from the eighties music are seen as a nuisance. Fans of the other stuff are seen as people who are "wrong" as they're not longing for the supposedly culturally relevant albums like The Circle or 2020. Jon Bon Jovi isn't proud of These Days. Doesn't really understand the music he's made as he's completely cancelled out the band effort that made the band big. He's all about his "Vision". He pats himself on the back for completely different reasons that fans feel are things to be proud of (A Grammy for Who Says, a cross-over hit, selling out stadiums, being inducted in the hall of fame).

Jon Bon Jovi wants to brag about the 150.000.000 album he's sold but ultimately really cares about the 1.000.000 no one cares for nowadays. The fanbase and its opinion on the band are polar opposites of what Jon thinks the band is about. So you're getting live versions of hits and re-releases of albums you rarely listen. And as long as Jon Bon Jovi will look down on past efforts and refuses to talk to fans who do follow his career in the great detail he wishes critics do there's no chance he'll ever release something interesting for die hards.

Salaam Aleikum,
Sebastiaan

Jon forgets himself. He wants to be this "artist" but ignores the he is and always has been more focused on the commercial side. It's very hard to blend integrity with commercial interests when you have spent three decades mostly chasing the latter.

Neither artistic integrity or fame chasing are bad, but it's almost impossible for a band to switch midstream from one to the other. Jon's problem is he doesn't realize he had more integrity when he was clear about what he was. What you write is correct, and there would be nothing at all wrong with it if Jon was not so intent on still chasing the commercial side.

He's McDonald's trying to be a Michelen Star restaruant that still sells Big Mac's.

Rdkopper · #**778** 04-17-2021, 04:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Captain_jovi

You can't really say "It's that simple" but also

".....Blood In The Water should have been the muscles behind it.

AND

"just write a fun catchy album that I can drive down the shore to"

Those are two polar opposite opinions. What do you mean? BITW is the definition of song you don't want.

I'm talking about 2 different albums. Original and Revised.

However, Blood In The Water is a great song and I do wish Jon never stated that the Storm he's referring to is Stormy Daniel's because until he said that, they weren't obvious lyrics and that's what makes the song great...Also, the way the song is structured and crafted is just so old school Bon Jovi. This one is the exception and gets a free pass.

The original 2020 could have been a great album if he just left it as is... Luv Can and Shine are very good songs and he pulled them off because they weren't "topical". He shouldn't have changed any of the lyrics to other songs either. Just left them as is.

American Reckoning should have been a non album track and not used to promote the album... The Jon only version of Do What You Can sounds like it was recorded in his home studio and the production doesn't match the album... After 911, Jon released American The Beautiful and these songs (eventhough original) remind me of that. They are charity raisers and break the vibe of the album.

So yes, last summer I drove back and forth from the shore listening to American Reckoning and Do What You Can (although upbeat, it's a fukcing drag).

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steel_horse75 · #**779** 04-17-2021, 08:42 AM

Agree that DWYC shouldn't have been on the album. Also adding the new (inferior) tracks, changing the order of songs and dropping 2 decent songs makes it unlistenable if you just press play on the CD. It's one reason my vinyl copy remains unopened as I can't change order.

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Captain_jovi · #**780** 04-17-2021, 04:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rdkopper

I'm talking about 2 different albums. Original and Revised.

However, Blood In The Water is a great song and I do wish Jon never stated that the Storm he's referring to is Stormy Daniel's because until he said that, they weren't obvious lyrics and that's what makes the song great...Also, the way the song is structured and crafted is just so old school Bon Jovi. This one is the exception and gets a free pass.

The original 2020 could have been a great album if he just left it as is... Luv Can and Shine are very good songs and he pulled them off because they weren't "topical". He shouldn't have changed any of the lyrics to other songs either. Just left them as is.

American Reckoning should have been a non album track and not used to promote the album... The Jon only version of Do What You Can sounds like it was recorded in his home studio and the production doesn't match the album... After 911, Jon released American The Beautiful and these songs (eventhough original) remind me of that. They are charity raisers and break the vibe of the album.

So yes, last summer I drove back and forth from the shore listening to American Reckoning and Do What You Can (although upbeat, it's a fukcing drag).

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Got it. Yeah I think I agree. It went from being an album of songs to a statement piece. When you take off 2 songs specifically because they didn't fit the new vision of the album, that's no bueno. Beautiful Drug starts the album in a fun place, Brothers in Arms not buried at the back keeps the fun pace going. The way they changed it, it's such a slog to get through downer after downer. As well written as they are it has no flow.

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