Ethical Decision

I'll keep this as loose as possible, in case anyone from work should ever find their way here. Infinitesmal possibility, but hey, why play around with Murphy's law?

I'm in the process of climbing the totem pole at work to about 3rd in command. I do my job well, I try my hardest, ask for more work when I'm finished with something, ask for ways I can improve...the manager (we'll call him M) likes and respects me, unfortunately, on days like today, a little too much. He trusts me to keep our conversations confidential, and has so far told me (beforehand) about the firing of two employees, both of whom I would've classified as friends. Never gave them any warning, just fired them. Whether they deserved it is up for debate, I won't even bother with that argument, but he never gave them a chance to get it right.

We hired a whole bunch of temporary employees for the Christmas season, most of whom I'm not really friends with. There are a handful of people I'll miss after the season, but not many. One of these kids (we'll call him J) has been a real turn around. When he started off, neither I nor M liked him - he was so laid-back we could've sworn he was on drugs (who knows?), he just seemed like a real under-achiever. A "blah" employee, not one who stands out. In about the past month he's turned around into one of the most productive people we have on staff.

T is another employee, been there about 6 months, got hired right around the same time I did. Dependable, always does their job right, but not a "wow is T the best employee or what" kind of person. One of my friends too. Now that the Christmas season is a few weeks away from wrapping up M is doing staff evaluations, and recently confided to me (why do I get stuck hearing all this stuff?) that he's thinking of "trading in" T for J. Not really for any definable reason (he could, if he wanted to be exact, find better reasons to fire ME than T). So again I'm stuck in the unenviable position of possibly seeing another one of my friends get the axe without any warning.

Part of me wants to avoid conflict, and just keep my head down, like I did the last 2 times M did this. Another part wants to give him a speech something along the lines of "your paycheck rents my time, it doesn't buy my soul, don't expect me to ignore and not stand by my friends." Another part wants to say that since I'm trustworthy enough to receive this information, I'd like to make a suggestion or two, like giving T a warning and some suggestions on turning it around. I'm wondering what to do here.

I'm already keeping the secret that a guy who's been there longer than me and who jumped up (temporarily) to 2nd in command is getting demoted to a position lower than mine (meanwhile he thinks temporary is going to become permanent). That's really gonna suck when he finds out - and yeah, M told me at least a month prior to when it will happen.

I love my job, really I do. I spend 5-10 hours a day talking about movies and music, hanging out with people that (for the most part) I really like, and then every two weeks they send me money for it. But with even mediocre power comes great responsibility (sorry Uncle Ben), and I really, really don't like it when M complains about other employees to me, or expects me to keep secrets on their employment status.

So, do I keep my head down and do nothing? Make suggestions to my boss (only seems fair, since he started this dialogue) and possibly lose a little favor? Drop some private hints to T that it might be time to step it up a little?

Thanks in advance,

Adrian

First you love your job. You want to keep it ...

I think this man is not very clever to tell this sort of thing to employee, but it shows you're a bit special, or different from the others there. Good for you of course. (as you love your job !).

You said these two employees are your friends, but friends since a few weeks ? and once they'll stop working there because it's the end of the contract maybe you'd never see them again ...??? Now it's different cause they'll have to leave before, but it's not your problem to tell them about it, this silly man didn't have to tell you, and you, you can't tell your 'friends' it's maybe too dangerous (if you want to keep your job). Maybe these friends don't really care of this job you know ...( Maybe you should ask ....)

Do you think it's possible that this man is trying to see if he can trust you, maybe he wants to know if you are going to tell your 'friends'. Cause more strange again, don't know why he did that, he certainly saw you're friends with these two others.

Your boss is an asshole. He's using you. If you go and start a discussion with him, your most likely the next one to leave. If you tell your friends, same thing.

I would leave, but it's not that easy.

Ice

Jess:For starters, J isn't exactly a friend of mine. I've known him only a few weeks, wouldn't really miss him. Not so with T. Known T for about as long as I've worked there.

Yes, I think this shows that the manager trusts me a lot. I know he likes my attitude, and I think I've proven my trustworthiness enough that he doesn't have to test me - I've kept this kind of information confidential twice now. I know he doesn't care about the friendships in the store though, he'll do what he thinks is best for the store/company.

Telling my friend outright is a little too dangerous. I don't think the manager would have a huge problem with me bringing it up again with him, asking if he was planning on giving them a warning or anything like that.

Ice:We're in agreeance (yeah, I know it isn't a real word) on this one. I know I'm getting used - M needs someone to talk to, and because I work hard and have shown an interest in climbing the foodchain, I get the dubious honor of knowing all this stuff beforehand (though to be honest, I'd rather know and maybe have a chance at influencing something than not and just walk in one day and hear that yet another person is gone). Quitting isn't really an option. I love everything about my job except for this one little detail, and I'm pretty sure I couldn't find another that would give me the same pay, flexibility with school, and enjoyable atmosphere.

Adrian

Adrian, I think what you experience is simply business as usual. It doesn't seem so unusual to me - my boss has his favorites that he'll conspire with and in a way I do too.

I don't think you should make too much out of it, however, I do think you should take the opportunity to ever so gently let him know what you think of some of the employees he is talking about. If he is considering firing someone who you don't think deserves to be fired, let him know. In a nice way, with good arguments.

Maybe you can use your 'special' position to exert some influence and keep some sort of justice.

Other than that... work sucks. Business sucks. People are assholes.

Adrian I think you should suggest that he gives the guys a chance before firing them without warning. Especially if he has no real reason to be disappointed by them. At least you will have tried to do something and he'll know what you think.

I wouldn't start a revolution over this though, he hired some extra staff for the Christmas season, so it wasn't a secret that he'd need to get rid of some people after that.

If he found what he thinks is a better employee in one of the new guys than one that was already there well, tough luck for the old timer. It's not like the new guy is trying to steal his place. After all you for one are going up in hierarchy taking someone else's place at each step out of merit. That's how things go. How hard you work and how good you are at your job is more important than the time you've been there, even though with time you're suppose to improve.

In the end, the boss is the boss and it's his decision, someone has to take the tough ones.
Maybe he told you because he trusts you enough and wouldn't mind having your opinion on the matter. I'd share mine : give them a warning and notice, if the boss had been satisfied by their work it's the least they deserve, and maybe try to work out a solution to keep both good employees.


Ponrauil

I'm with Ice on this - the boss is an asshole. My former boss confided in me in some matters as well, as long as I agreed with him. In some matters I actually did agree with him, but as soon as I started disagreeing and even expressing some criticism, I got transferred to another department.

I don't like bosses confiding in employees on matters like these - it's not fair to the persons who are kicked out, but it's also not fair to the persons who are confided in. Adrian is put in the middle of something he didn't want and a good boss should've thought of that.

You think that his confiding in me gives me the "right" (for lack of a better word, this has nothing to do with rights) to give feedback? I really don't want to step on his toes... I'm definitely not going to start a revolution, I just want to see something fair go down (for once). What really irks me about this situation is he doesn't HAVE to fire anyone except for most of the temporary people - all of whom know they're just here for a few weeks. We're already missing 1 part-timer who's job could be filled by a temp, and if/when I move up, we'll be missing another.

I'm actually not taking anyone's job, the third-in-command spot has been vacant for about 3 months. Vacated by those two friends I mentioned in my first post, one right after the other.

Adrian

i dont exactly see why he's confiding in you to be honest I mean if you're not having anything to do with the firing then it is just at least perpetuating rumours to spread.

unless he is testing you....

one thing i will say is that if this new guy is doing considerably better than the dude thats been there longer then it's tuff titty for the old dude. the boss has to keep the most productive members of staff.

if my boss started talking to me about people she was going to fire or talkign behind peoples backs i'd politely tell her that i didnt really think it was any of my business and i wasn't necesarilly the best person to talk to about it.

on the other hand im just glad where i am there, i might approach it differently if i wanted to climb up the ladder. BUT bear that in mind, this guy is obviusly ready willign and able to dick people over, you never know when it could be you....

The boss can be an asshole as much as he wants ... he's the boss! And I suppose if he's ruthless, thats just his was of running the business .. who knows, perhaps there's a reason for it. Anyway, if you really think you can catiously mention it to him without getting burned, go for it ... otherwise, keep you're head down, you really have no duty to save everyone