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  #111  
Old 03-24-2004, 12:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Mongoose
indeed, a publicity success. Wonder how much Mel has made from these "debates"
Hehehe...too much! Now he is thinking about doing another movie dealing with religion. Why not? It pays a ton.
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  #112  
Old 03-24-2004, 01:32 AM
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all things above were just opinions where you can agree or not. but this here is simply wrong, cause now in the time with less religion in the western world than ever before, there are a lot less wars or epidemic plagues than ever before! since over 1000 years there has never been such a long period without a war in middle europe as we have now since ww2. there have been pest, cholera etc. etc. here that sometimes killed over 50% of the population in the medieval age, where people were more religious than ever.... i could go on and on
Yeah also differnt in the fact that every thing thats classed as right end dont murder, rape steal lie all comes from the bible. Do you really think if humanity was allowed to form its own socity that it would be anything like this?. When you look around at todays world its a nightmare weather you admit it or not. Theres more murders more rapes more muggings, more drugs everything. And i know for a fact in scotland anywhat it was nothing like it is now when my parents were kids that in scotland shows that things are getting worse and worse and were you asleep during the afganistan and iraq wars? you think thats the end of the war on terrorism i think not lol. And also what was sars was that just a little 'glitch' then?. Sure it wasnt a full blown plague but it was damn close and it did enough damage. You mention all those illnesses how about replacing them with the words cancer and aids..... i bet those two have killled as much. And two wars in pretty much the last 2 years isnt less its more!.

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and otherwise we would have followed another book for 3000 years maybe. 3000 years, so what? does that make the book more "true"?
What proof is there that we would have followed another?. That comment makes no sence at all.

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well it was written by men, so i don't get what you mean here! or do you think it was written by God himself or what?
Yes it was written by men....men selected by god to write it. So what does that have to do with anything?.
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  #113  
Old 03-24-2004, 02:59 AM
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Originally Posted by joviscout
in the fact that every thing thats classed as right end dont murder, rape steal lie all comes from the bible.
nope. it is written in the bible but in about 90% of the places where people now belief this, there were already these laws before they became christians. and there haven't been less murders after the christianisation. there have never been as many rapes as in the medieval age, where people believed most. etc. etc.

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well it was written by men, so i don't get what you mean here! or do you think it was written by God himself or what?
Yes it was written by men....men selected by god to write it. So what does that have to do with anything?
you said that without God giving us the bible, nobody could think of rules like that. I think that the people who have written the bible have thought of all these rules. there are almost the same rules all over the world, wether they believe in the bible or not, so no, we don't need a bible to write rules like that. our conscience tells us whats right and whats wrong without ever reading a book like the bible.

i don't have anything against religion or against the bible, but it's just wrong that there wouldn't be any laws without it. or how do you explain that they have similar laws all over the world?

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Originally Posted by joviscout
were you asleep during the afganistan and iraq wars? you think thats the end of the war on terrorism i think not lol. And also what was sars was that just a little 'glitch' then?. Sure it wasnt a full blown plague but it was damn close and it did enough damage. You mention all those illnesses how about replacing them with the words cancer and aids..... i bet those two have killled as much.
you bet those have killed as much? haven't heard much about the pest then! and even with aids and cancer it is wrong that there are more diseases around these days.

no, i wasn't asleep, but the wars you named weren't fought in europe. i was clearly talking about wars in europe! if you count them all over the world there are much more than 2 wars anyway, but i was talking about europe where people aren't too religious anymore and you said, the less religion the more wars. (in reality religion was always a "good reason" for a war, the crushades for example).

and then you said the more we go away from the bible the more viruses we have and you name SARS as an example. SARS was mainly a problem in and from asia. people there never followed the bible and never changed their religious believs much. so i can't see a link between bible and SARS even if i try to tollerate a lot of fuzzy logic.
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  #114  
Old 03-24-2004, 04:00 AM
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nope. it is written in the bible but in about 90% of the places where people now belief this, there were already these laws before they became christians. and there haven't been less murders after the christianisation. there have never been as many rapes as in the medieval age, where people believed most. etc. etc.
Im talking about the part the bible played in the building of socity to me if it wasnt for it the world would be very differnt depending on human nature to build rules and laws wouldnt work out well i dont think just look at any dictatorship to work that one out.
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you said that without God giving us the bible, nobody could think of rules like that. I think that the people who have written the bible have thought of all these rules. there are almost the same rules all over the world, wether they believe in the bible or not, so no, we don't need a bible to write rules like that. our conscience tells us whats right and whats wrong without ever reading a book like the bible.
And where do you think our consious came from?. If none of that were true then think of it we would develop from cave men where the only rule was to survive we wouldnt be like we are now. And im not talking about people beliving in the bible now im talking about then back when almost everyone did whas when whats right and wrong was installed into everyone and those came from the bible and now they are considerd just our consious but if you read the bible you will find every moral human value from it.
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i don't have anything against religion or against the bible, but it's just wrong that there wouldn't be any laws without it. or how do you explain that they have similar laws all over the world?
Again you miss the point im talking about 3000 years in the past read the bible it explains how everything happend. All im gonna say is your talking about a book written 3000 years ago that since then morals have been based on in 3000 years its pretty easy logic to assume that its gonna have spread around the world.

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you bet those have killed as much? haven't heard much about the pest then! and even with aids and cancer it is wrong that there are more diseases around these days.
No you are wrong there is more diseases now than ever due to radiation and anything else we have created. Everything from drinking to smoking to even sun bathing cause we have destroyed the atmosphere can trigger diseases. Also remember the population of the world was much much smaller in these mid evil times you keep referring to so those two alone have quite likely killed as much. Also third world you remember that thousands die everyday there from diesease so theres more much more than in mid evil times.
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and then you said the more we go away from the bible the more viruses we have and you name SARS as an example. SARS was mainly a problem in and from asia. people there never followed the bible and never changed their religious believs much
Actually hong kong which is where SARS was at its worst has many christain churches. And many converted to it during it also. I watched a documentary on it and when sars hit the belivers in christianity all started meeting everyday to reinforce god in there lifes everyday they helped the community and then prayed and such and just as the bible said at the end of the 52 days was the same day the WHO declared hong knog sars free.

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so i can't see a link between bible and SARS even if i try to tollerate a lot of fuzzy logic.
Was that a attempt at a insult?.
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