Lessons of Islam in German Classooms

That is nuts. She shouldn't be allowed to pass the class then if she can't complete the required coursework. Not to mention the fact that this poor girl is made to feel like an outsider. She will be one to rebel in the future. These kind of stories really do scare me.

But surely failing her would be racist?

they don't get much chance to rebel either. "honour" killings are increasing here and I can't imagine the US taking too long to catch up. kinda says it all when someone will kill a family member for their religion.

but I digress.

Religion should be kept out of schools altogether apart from teaching about other religions. My primary school was right next to a Catholic school, exact same building, kids from the same area's with the exception that most in my school were Protestant and everyone in the other school was catholic. All it does is breed hate and enforce the idea that people are different from a very young age.

Unfortunately - many schools are making exceptions it seems - for anyone that objects to anything. My daughter tells me that at least half of her class that should be in the Health class (read sex ed) has had their parents pull them out of the class because they don't only teach abstinence. Get real - these are high school freshman - they need facts about sex and birth control or the teenage pregnancy rate is going to go back to being as bad as it used to be in this country - sigh.

Kathleen

As a muslim who is well assimilated with western culture I have to tell you the following: (please approach this with an open and an intellectual mind):

With recent events in the world the western media has put a spot light on the traditional, conservative and fanatical islamic societies. I have yet to spot stories about ppl like myself and others that I am surrounded by who hold on to their islamic teachings as a guide for living but understand that it is only a guideline and incorporate the other beneficial views they learn in their everyday life by living in the Western world. I do not look at all Catholics as pedafiles (sp?) simply because some catholic priests choose to engage in sexual activities with young boys.

For every backward thinking muslim you point out, I can show you the same for a christian, jew or muslim. And for every modern person you show me, I can provide an example of a muslim that meets those criterion.

If you want to speak in terms of pure religion and hold up the Koran against the Bible or Torah...you will see that Islam is more refined and more up to date. And thats logical as Islam came to light some 600 years after christianity and thousands of years after Judaism. For every fundamentalist Islamic society there exists its counterpart. By that I mean both a modern progressive Islamic society and also fundamentalist Christian or Jewish societies.

For all the backward thinkers in Islam who believe women to be a second class citizen there are us who look at them and laugh at them. Any intelligent mind should be able to analyze Islam and find the equality of men and women in there.

If all of you are simply shocked and annoyed at the backward style of thinking, I can't blame you because I share the same view. However, I urge that none of you associate this with what the Islam religion is all about.

But are men and women really equal according to the Koran?

yes they are. More so than any other religion. In addition to the Koran you have to look at the stories during the time of Mohammad. In Islam (and here I will go by the books, not whats in practice)...Women have rights to divorce and property. Try finding that in the Bible or the Torah. I don't mean to offend any Christians or Jews here but if you have doubts look into your holy books. In Judaism, men pray thanking God for making them a man and women pray for God to have mercy on them. Both the Torah and Bible blame Eve for the incident with the forbidden fruit. The Koran does not put any blame on either and also notes that Adam and Eve ate the fruit on their own accord. There is no blame on Eve for tricking or convincing Adam to eating the forbidden fruit. I will admit that its not complete 50/50 but it is far more so than the other religious books.

But thats where people need to seperate time and culture from the scriptures. These were things written down in 600 AD. its 2004 now. Back then roles were defined as they needed to be.

Like I said. I'm not defending the actions of those who choose to advance with time. But how can you tell me muslims are the only to blame when I look at the large number of cases of domestic abuse in western society. You look at USA where the possiblity of a female leader is unimaginable. Whereas, MUSLIM countries like Bangladesh and Pakistan and India (although not a muslim nation, the 2nd largest muslim population) have had muslim female leaders....ELECTED.

Take a look at Jewish orthodox societies and Christian based societies in rural areas and tell me that they too do not treat women unfairly.

sry..it should those who choose NOT to advance with time.

excellent post MrSambo. As much as I would like to think of myself as an open-minded and tolerant person, I have to admit that I too fall into the trap of generalizing certain religions and cultures (religions and cultures I know very little of).

It is so much easier to notice the muslim girl that is not allowed to participate in gym class, than to notice the 3 other muslim kids that are completely integrated. Just human nature, I suppose, but we really do need to remind ourselves that exceptions are found in every culture.

Good film Mr. Sambo, good film.

Its not so easy and you only have to see how the woman "live" in Islam countries

In the case of women, The Koran is very specific when it comes down to how they are to be treated and their role in life. “Women shall with justice have rights similar to those exercised against them, although men have a status above women.” As long as you are not a true believer, you will never really know what this exactly means. Obviously in The Koran, men have more rights than women. But then how is this statement to be understood? In The Koran, men and women have rights that are far more gender bias; men are guided more towards money and power, while women are guided towards a family and the home. It is a society in which the woman is in charge inside of the house while the man has more power outside. People would think of this as degrading towards women, but it is done to look after them. As a protection to women, men are forced to go outside of the house into the world that is cold and evil. They are told that they must do this everyday and bring home money to provide for their family and wife. The woman is to stay home in a safe place and take care of what she knows best. This is not mean to make women feel inferior but to make them feel safe and free from the world

But.....

There are many reasons why people believe that women are treated without respect in the Islamic nations. First and foremost, it says in The Koran that women may be beaten: Men have authority over women because God has made the one superior to the other, and because they spend their wealth to maintain them. Good women are obedient. They guard their unseen parts because God has guarded them. As for those from whom you fear disobedience, admonish them, forsake them in beds apart, and beat them. Then if they obey you, take no further action against them.

And of course you can find many stupid quotes in the bible, but see how woman live in our countries and how they live in islamic countries. Its not only religion, but its impossible to compare.