Originally Posted by DevilsSon

I was sooo happy they lost. They had just won the Bundesliga and Leverkusen was 2nd (like in all 3 competitions they took part in that year) and Bayern 3rd. The first 2 were playing European finals and I was just watchin being sad.



Looking back at history, Bayern's main opponent in the late 60s(that's when we got big) was Dortmund. In the 70s it was Borussia Mönchengladbach. In the 80s it was Hamburg, in the 90s it was Dortmund and Leverkusen and in the 00s it seems it is Werder Bremen. Regarding budgets, German teams have very low TV contracts that's why in recent years, especially since the Kirch-Media Coup, the Bundesliga has tremendously declined in quality. things are slightly improving but still it can't compete with the Premiership. German teams still get most money from T-shirt advertising (Schalke 04 gets 25 Million Euros a year, nobody gets that much) and out of the Champions League (bayern is num,ber 1 top earner in CL history) and also from the stadiums...but in any other league, this money is maybe half of what they get from TV. Bayern has had good management and they accumulated a lot of money (used to be 2nd wealthiest club in the world after ManU) so it could afford buying the best players of its direct opponents: Basler, Pizzaro, Ismael (Bremen), Ballack, Ze Roberto, Lucio (Leverkusen), Van Buyten (Hamburg) staying this way on top every year. I guess it's more a matter of good management than of anything else. Of course, DORTMUND was wealthy enough on its own but stock registration ruined them. Has little to with football...




Not always, the 70s and 80s were dominated by Liverpool, Nottingham Forrest and Leeds. ManU and Arsenal dominated the league only in the 90s.



England had at least one Champions Cup winner each decade. I guess they did not have any international results because they got a 7 year ban after the 1985 final when Liverpool met Juve and it ended in riots and a lot of fans died. It took them quite a while to recover from that but now they have the best league in the world, by far...also helped by the immense money inflow which runs there these day (but again, which was first, hen or egg, money or performance?)

Originally Posted by DevilsSon

agreed....although, doesn't Feyenord have a Champions Cup as well?

Originally Posted by DevilsSon

NO WAY. I mean, all respect for Holland but if you go lower than 5th place, it's pretty much the level of German 2nd league. Belgium is not even worth mentioning. And in France, there's only one real team anyway. I mean, look at Lense who is second. They only luckily beat Leverkusen at home with 2-1 and Leverkusen is currently 7th...so, no.

I would say right now, the best league is by far the Premiership followed by the Spanish League.Then joint 3rd place Germany and Italy.