well i am disappointed in Tico! The one guy i thought who would be able to bash the two over inflated egos of Jon and Richie together hasn't!

How are people still under the impression Jon is holding Richie back musically? He's as part of the problem as Jon. Unless you consider Come Back as Me a hard rock song.

It seems to be the biggest fallacy on this board and irritates the hell out of me every time I read it.

I'm pretty sure Richie's had the freedom to do whatever he wants as lead guitarist - he just hasn't wanted to do very much.

I find I can't listen to Bon Jovi's music anymore without thinking of this Richie mess and Jon's current touring voice, really ruining it for me...............and I'm a fan of the new stuff. Can't imagine how bad it must be for those who find the new stuff to be terrible and Jon's voice atrocious.

I think in Jons persuit of keeping the Bon Jovi sound fresh and appealing to the modern generation (which I dont blame him for) he has toned down Richies input "guitarwise", in the fact that we dont see any DRY COUNTY type songs, I know THE CIRCLE had a guitar heavy sound but there was no long solos letting him loose to do his own thing etc , id like to see a lean back to the SLIPPERY days, yes I know Jons voice has to be taken into consideration etc etc....and IM not even saying make SWW Pt2 , but I think Richies guitar playing has been toned down on the albums, its either that he he really isnt arsed with the band anymore,
WWBTF was the classic, the original guitar solo was terrible, its not great now....and theres not that much on WAN.
SO if he really isnt arsed, and all this "personal issues" bullshit is about him wanting out, then let him go.....

I'm one of the latter so let me tell you: We don't give a crap anymore. We just listen to the music we enjoy, as simple as that. I'm there for the odd These Days or Dry County performance, for the Tokyo Road and Only Lonely, for the acoustic Santa Fe and Something for the pain. I don't care about almost any of the new songs being performed live or even the studio versions.

it's incredible what an unrelatable bunch of strangers these guys, and Richie in particular, have become and how unrecognisable this band are to me at the moment.

I don't find Jon's voice atrocious on the record, though obviously Shanks has a say in that.

His voice sucks live because he doesn't prepare himself properly. He's lazy. I've said this many times, Joe Elliot's voice had shit the bed years back, and he went out got himself a vocal coach, practiced his ass off, and got his voice sounding stronger than ever. It can be done. Jon just doesn't care anymore.

I was thinking about this whole thing this morning. It really is sad. I remember back in 1992 before Keep The Faith came out, there was some special on MTV where Jon went on and on about "the machine" and how he needed it to get back to being about the music and having fun. We all know the story.

It just sucks that he has become and has made the band the one thing he loathed so much.

Keep in mind that according to Bob Rock, Bon Jovi were very much a party of the machine by then as well.

Any good examples of Joe Elliot getting his voice back? I've seen him suck a ton over the last years plenty of times, but wasn't aware he ever recovered.