Hmmm that would mean that's not what the black dots on the setlist are for in that case.

I know I have heard that Tico plays to a click track on most, if not every, song.

Regarding playback on Prayer, this has been going on since he absolutely destroyed his vocal chords on the slippery tour. The guy was getting steroid shots directly into his throat night after night. I don't think he's ever sang the the chorus or key change without at least a backing track, but I'd say he's full on lip synced it a majority of the time.

Though I don't know what they are for, there most likely not for that. Otherwise they would've been on older setlists too and they weren't there.

He sang it at some places in '86 and killed his voice with that. I think ever since their headliner tour, they always had a backup track running.

And regarding the click-track: Bounce had contact to a guy working in the business and who had worked for Scorpions, Bon Jovi and other big acts and he explained to them that there's a lot of "masquerade" going on during all these shows in terms of backing tracks underlying the music at almost every song in one way or the other to give it all more "ooomph". And all these cues as well as the screen animations are linked to those click tracks too. Bounce play to click-tracks for all songs except piano ballads and Bed of Roses as well. Their drummer and keyboarder can turn them off manually during a song if needed though and I'm sure Tico could do the same.
And we were all able to hear what a mess could come of it when someone ****s up like Tico on Prayer in Japan '06 :-D

Arena and stadium acts need click tracks for lighting and video cues to synch up with the music and also to keep the band in time because us drummers can get carried away from time to time.

Different bands have it to varying degrees. U2 have quite an elaborate click track cueing system going on which is as far removed from rock and roll as I could imagine.

https://youtu.be/pl-VzRZVVJI

I think the dots also depend on the person the setlist stems from.
I checked various setlists and I got one from Uncasville from January 25, 2017 without dots and another one from Greenville from February 8, 2017 with dots.

Could anyone help me understand what you guys are saying? So JBJ isn't singing 100% on his own while in a live concert? I don't mean having someone from behind like Bobby or Richie or Everrett who can cover his voice weakness, I mean is there anything pre-recorded playing at the back? That's what you are saying?

Yes. And it's common courtesy for most of the big bands. Not to be mistaken with saying that they aren't playing live because they most certainly do. But it's much more smoke and mirrors than many may think. They do have pre-recorded tracks for choruses and certain lead singer vocal lines in there at a certain (lower) volume to give it more power live. When Nickelback played in Cologne a few years agp, they spontaneously entered a jam session and Chad was standing on the side of the stage talking to somebody while his vocals were still very audible coming over the PA.

With Bon Jovi, it's been nothing else: On the New Jersey tour, Jon faked that high "Livin' On A Prayer" before the solo throughout and once, in Chile, they forgot to trigger the backing track. Just look at Jon's stink eye towards the sound mixer at 4:20

On the KTF tour, they had certain back-up tracks as well. I'm sure the chorus of Keep The Faith had some of it, the "faith" parts were triggered by David Bryan if I remember correctly as well. Take In These Arms from Dortmund 1993 at 1:56:48
After Jon had improvised, he puts his mic down and you can CLEARY hear his "baaabyyyy" over the PA.

In 2013, when he had his hayfever attack in Sofia, people mentioned that you could still hear his voice at parts like ITA while David was actually singing for Jon.

As I said, this doesn't take anything away from Bon Jovi's outstanding playing for three decades! All of the bigger acts do have that and I think it was either Jon or Richie who once said that "live shows are always a bit of mirrors and smoke". When I first saw Bounce, they just played live as 5 guys and some of the stuff sounded somewhat empty. Until they got that advice from the person who had worked in the business (mentioned above) and added a few pre-recorded tracks to (especially newer) songs and went into their studio to record gang vocals for some choruses like It's My Life. Since then, the sound has gotten much fuller and powerful.

I see. Well I was at the concert in Sofia, I didn't notice what you mention but that's I guess cause I was so delighted seeing Bon Jovi performing either way :P

At around 5 mins in this performance Jon misses his cue and is quite obviously miming because you can hear his voice when he is 5 metres away from his mic stand.

He's so relaxed about it though. I'm not sure how much of the vocal is on tape. Possibly just the short spoken part after the solo.

https://youtu.be/B19RQBQFAuY]

Pretty sure that this was either bad editing for the TV broadcast (like Richie's Living In Sin solo in Santiago 1990) or an overdub. There was an article posted here at some point from that era where it was explained that Jon spent the entire night in the studio after the show in order to check and fix possible voice problems.

That doesn't make sense though because when Jon reaches the mic he's already missed a line. If he missed his cue and there was no backing track he'd just start over but he doesn't.

I'm not denying the fact there were over dubs but it doesn't make sense in this context.

A lot of Prayer from 1987 is lip synced by Jon. His vocals were shot to pieces and he just couldn't sing it.

I just listened to the audience recording of that night and Jon sang it in time, a little inaudible on the first line, but on cue.
So it was just poor editing by the Japanese. Much like Living In Sin from Santiago 1990 or Bad Name from the official Wembley DVD.

They did have that playback track going ever since the headliner tour in very late 1986 took off in the USA. Sometimes louder, sometimes not that noticeable. Here it is just brutally obvious because his voice is like hell in the verses and then it gets fine, plus it's from the mixing desk. I'm always amused at fans raving about "best LOAP, he sang all the high notes" on Youtube on 1987 shows when in fact it was playback with Jon on top of it. It just wasn't that clear on earlier shows since his voice was still fine in the verses and the difference wasn't that big then. :mrgreen:

So you're saying that the video footage was edited badly? Which has nothing to do with over dubs.

Do you have the recording available so I can listen?

I hadn't watched that part at that point, simply remembered that overdubs were done the night afterwards for the later broadcast.
In this case, I really think it was bad editing or a mix of both. Like Ruanway from Tokyo 1985 where the screams were overdubbed later and bad editing make it seem like poor lip-syncing in parts.
Here's Tokyo Road from a (poor) audience recording to compare:
https://www.sendspace.com/file/hkjs5g

It is kind of ridiculous to use the high note playback from 2013, after the solo the backing track from 1989 (like someone said in the comments) and in my opinion the "take my hand" part is now prerecorded from David in my opinion because it sounds exactly the same at every concert.

Why aren't they using the hall of fame edited version as backing track. Nobody who doesn't follow the band closely would notice it but to use the track from 1989 is ridiculous.

That's definitely not David on the "Take my hand, we'll make it I swear " part. It's Jon's voice from the SWW album.

At 2:33
Are you sure that this is the SWW album version. Sounds different and not like Jon to me but I could be mistaken?

I wasn't talking about Stockholm though. Here it sounds like it's not playback, it's just David singing "take my hand, we'll make it I swear" live. What I was talking about, In the Dusseldorf and Munich concerts, the "Take my hand, we'll make it I swear " parts in the key change are definitely Jon's voice from the SWW album.

in Düsseldorf at 1:54 it sounds to me exactly like stockholm. I think they have for the two "take my hand.." parts before the solo a backing track that David recorded and after the solo they switch to the SWW version

Listening to the Dusseldorf one, at 1:54 on the "Take my hand " part, it sounds like Jon's voice from the SWW album. It might sound a little different to you because it seems that there is someone singing over it.

Ok thanks that could be it.
Nevertheless absolutely stupid to use 30 year old backing tracks. Jon knows how bad his voice is. He should have recorded a new one before the tour or use the hall of fame version.

Well, they were using the same backing track from SWW in 2006 so I don't think it would stop them. I actually want them to use them, the backing tracks just make the song better live. Without them, the choruses which are supposed to be the best parts of the song, are kinda dead. The backing tracks just seem to add more "punch" or "rock" live.

I think pretty much every clip of the playback line I've seen, Jon has stopped miming and moved from the mic too early on every single one of them. Stockholm and Moscow were pretty damn obvious.