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Supersonic 09-01-2019 12:08 AM

Aloha !

Quote:

Originally Posted by faith1985 (Post 1258726)
See, you did not get what I was saying. I said if a teen would read a sentence like 'you are sensitive like shit' it might harm him or her. And as an example for this I said that these things harmed me when I was younger and I know several people who were bullied and deeply wounded by it. You are -again - twisting things: I did said the kind of behavior you display might hurt fragile people very deeply. You are showing no signs of empathy here and yes, to be honest, if everybody would act like this I would absolutely look for a hole and stay there

Again, it's all irrelevant personal information. I wasn't talking to a teenager, I was talking to you. Saying the way I act might lead to teenagers committing suicide is desperately stretching things just so you can validate the ridiculous things you've said.

I also shouldn't need to be empathic over calling a grown-up on the internet out on her bullshit. You drag in all this personal drama over being bullied for being ugly and what not into the conversation but down the line it's all irrelevant. If your personal trauma prevents you from being capable of dealing with people questioning your thoughts you should keep your thoughts to yourself as opposed to posting them out in the open. You were the one coming up with all this nonsense about Jon's infidelity and his narcissistic behaviour. Not me. And once you were called out on it you started backtracking step by step by digging an even deeper hole. None of this has done you any favours. You're the definition of a drama queen. "I'm leaving, bye" followed up by an endless stream of posts full of self pity.

But sure, what the essence of your story is, is this; You need to be dealt with as if you're a teenager as you're just not mature enough to deal with the way grown up people handle bullshit.

So here goes; Go to your room and stay there.

Salaam Aleikum,
Sebastiaan

faith1985 09-01-2019 12:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Supersonic (Post 1258728)
Aloha !



Again, it's all irrelevant personal information. I wasn't talking to a teenager, I was talking to you. Saying the way I act might lead to teenagers committing suicide is desperately stretching things just so you can validate the ridiculous things you've said.

I also shouldn't need to be empathic over calling a grown-up on the internet out on her bullshit. You drag in all this personal drama over being bullied for being ugly and what not into the conversation but down the line it's all irrelevant. If your personal trauma prevents you from being capable of dealing with people questioning your thoughts you should keep your thoughts to yourself as opposed to posting them out in the open. You were the one coming up with all this nonsense about Jon's infidelity and his narcissistic behaviour. Not me. And once you were called out on it you started backtracking step by step by digging an even deeper hole. None of this has done you any favours. You're the definition of a drama queen. "I'm leaving, bye" followed up by an endless stream of posts full of self pity.

But sure, what the essence of your story is, is this; You need to be dealt with as if you're a teenager as you're just not mature enough to deal with the way grown up people handle bullshit.

So here goes; Go to your room and stay there.

Salaam Aleikum,
Sebastiaan

Sebastiaan, now it is really starting to get annoying. Eveline said that people commit suicide because they were being bullied. And I agreed to that and on a lower level people like you can be very hurtful.

There is a normal way to tell someone he or she is wrong and there is the way you do it. If you think the way you react to others is 'a normal way' to do it as a grown-up then sorry, I have to tell you that several people do not share your opinion but I am sure we are all inmature pussys who cannot 'handle the heat'

And if others don't think Jon is showing certain signs of narcissism outside the norm, I am still 'allowed' to see them. And there is no need to attack me on this.

And regarding Jonny's infidelity: He himself said he cheated and there are several songs that are about cheating; yes it can all be some show but if you talk about having cheated and writing about it it is not that far off to connect it.

I have no problem with people criticising me as long as it is respectful. It has nothing to do with anything I've experienced when I was younger. But the moment someone criticizes you, you either become defensive or insulting or you start ridiculing the other person. CaptainJovi said my remarks were way off and I do not at all have a problem with it but when you start insulting, why should I take anything you say seriously?

bonjovi90 09-01-2019 02:19 AM

My final two cents on this:
Yes, Seb has had times where he may have been hard to deal with and maybe have acted over the top, but I've not seen him systematically bullying people here. Pulling pranks with fake news and websites - yes. Making fun of (partly really naive) users - yes. Bullying - no.
It seems that it frightens some people when he reacts to their theories and challenges them to properly back up something or discuss it with different points of views. As soon as some comments come across a bit harsh, he's referred to as having no other agenda than giving people a hard time or making them look bad.

And in this case, "there's two sides to every story" - to quote your Jon song about secretly cheating. Some of Seb's comments may have been harsh, I give you that, but (bar Eveline) any other user who is currently participating here called you out on your theory as well - some even with proper background in that field. When you post a theory that is, let's say, that risky - you are bound to have wind blowing in your face. And as you tried to hammer it home, no matter how many users said that it seemed a bit too far fetched, it's only natural that some get annoyed. Keep in mind that it was clogging up two threads that had nothing to do with it and when I logged in and was expecting news and kept reading the same story over and over, I was rolling my eyes as well. Especially since that very same story had been spread over several threads one or two years ago already when you had your "Soul Kitchen experience" or whatever it may have been.
If it is so important to you, you can open up a thread about and discuss it with people there. No one stops you from doing this.

And finally - yes, bullying is a very important issue in modern-days society. I'm a teacher myself and in daily institutions or peer groups on social media, that can easily take a dangerous turn. But in an open Bon Jovi forum that has been known for having a rough tone at times, every one is free to join or leave if they don't feel right here. But going from a discussion with maybe a few harsh words to the suicial part is over the edge. I'm not talking about the past or what happened in your private life, but in this case, you're no victim here. You tried to hammer home your logic and other users got fed up with it at some point.
And about this place being unfriendly - post that theory underneath a current post on Bon Jovi's IG or FB account and watch it unfold. Then you'll see that this here actually is quite a nice and cozy place to be.

And now - for the sake of everybody's health - maybe a mod can close this and we can all move on?

thesedays2014 09-01-2019 02:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bonjovi90 (Post 1258731)
My final two cents on this:
Yes, Seb has had times where he may have been hard to deal with and maybe have acted over the top, but I've not seen him systematically bullying people here. Pulling pranks with fake news and websites - yes. Making fun of (partly really naive) users - yes. Bullying - no.
It seems that it frightens some people when he reacts to their theories and challenges them to properly back up something or discuss it with different points of views. As soon as some comments come across a bit harsh, he's referred to as having no other agenda than giving people a hard time or making them

And now - for the sake of everybody's health - maybe a mod can close this and we can all move on?

The difference between making fun and bullying is very subjective. I understand Seb is just carrying out his job and fulfilling what his ‘persona’ on this board entails. However, his challenging and knowledge is extremely simple and very often utter bullshit and it seems that’s when he turns to the making fun/bullying.
I don’t see any other point for him to have even responded to this thread, for example.

You get people like Seb all over the place: clever (but not necessarily intelligent) people that know a few facts and make up convincing stories and sell them as if they were knowledge. A few people think ‘wow, this guy is great’ and follow and support his stories. Others get irritated and others just step back and think ‘what an idiot’.

Different ‘personas’, that’s all. If you find challenging fun, do it; if you take offence, turn a blind eye. You’re not going to get rid of the Sebs of this world

faith1985 09-01-2019 03:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bonjovi90 (Post 1258731)
My final two cents on this:
Yes, Seb has had times where he may have been hard to deal with and maybe have acted over the top, but I've not seen him systematically bullying people here. Pulling pranks with fake news and websites - yes. Making fun of (partly really naive) users - yes. Bullying - no.
It seems that it frightens some people when he reacts to their theories and challenges them to properly back up something or discuss it with different points of views. As soon as some comments come across a bit harsh, he's referred to as having no other agenda than giving people a hard time or making them look bad.

And in this case, "there's two sides to every story" - to quote your Jon song about secretly cheating. Some of Seb's comments may have been harsh, I give you that, but (bar Eveline) any other user who is currently participating here called you out on your theory as well - some even with proper background in that field. When you post a theory that is, let's say, that risky - you are bound to have wind blowing in your face. And as you tried to hammer it home, no matter how many users said that it seemed a bit too far fetched, it's only natural that some get annoyed. Keep in mind that it was clogging up two threads that had nothing to do with it and when I logged in and was expecting news and kept reading the same story over and over, I was rolling my eyes as well. Especially since that very same story had been spread over several threads one or two years ago already when you had your "Soul Kitchen experience" or whatever it may have been.
If it is so important to you, you can open up a thread about and discuss it with people there. No one stops you from doing this.

And finally - yes, bullying is a very important issue in modern-days society. I'm a teacher myself and in daily institutions or peer groups on social media, that can easily take a dangerous turn. But in an open Bon Jovi forum that has been known for having a rough tone at times, every one is free to join or leave if they don't feel right here. But going from a discussion with maybe a few harsh words to the suicial part is over the edge. I'm not talking about the past or what happened in your private life, but in this case, you're no victim here. You tried to hammer home your logic and other users got fed up with it at some point.
And about this place being unfriendly - post that theory underneath a current post on Bon Jovi's IG or FB account and watch it unfold. Then you'll see that this here actually is quite a nice and cozy place to be.

And now - for the sake of everybody's health - maybe a mod can close this and we can all move on?

How often do I need to say that I do not have a problem with people critizising me as long as it is not insulting. I did not complain about people thinking my theory is wrong (BTW there are people who have called Jon a narcissist and I stand by my opinion that Jon shows more tendencies regarding narcissistic traits then many other people. Never did I say he is a full blown narcissist.. I do not feel bullied by Sebastian but I do think his tone is really degrading which has nothing to do with a normal debate. I do not feel like a victim I just think (and I have to say your post of not remotly trying to understand why I said that Supersonic's is strange. Thierry called Yovana a stupid cunt. Supersonic said I should crawl in a hole. I did work as an after school teacher and I met children who had to deal with these kind of little 'harsh comments' as you call them did damage to them.

If you think these the following are nothing more than a bit harsh then - as I said - all the people who are complaining about Supersonic or Thierry being too arrogant and a bully are all idiots then:

Stupid cunt
You need to be dealt with as if you're a teenager as you're just not mature enough to deal with the way grown up people handle bullshit.
Whatever respect people had for you was wiped off the table and you'll always be seen as "that crazy one" from now on
Is your hole not deep enough yet?

These are not just a bit harsh, these are insulting, ignorant and degrading And - since you said you are a teacher - if you would tolerate this being said to one of your students OR anyone for that matter I am a bit puzzled

And as I said, I am leaving. So go on, close the thread because it is bothering you and then it is over.

faith1985 09-01-2019 03:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thesedays2014 (Post 1258732)
The difference between making fun and bullying is very subjective. I understand Seb is just carrying out his job and fulfilling what his ‘persona’ on this board entails. However, his challenging and knowledge is extremely simple and very often utter bullshit and it seems that’s when he turns to the making fun/bullying.
I don’t see any other point for him to have even responded to this thread, for example.

You get people like Seb all over the place: clever (but not necessarily intelligent) people that know a few facts and make up convincing stories and sell them as if they were knowledge. A few people think ‘wow, this guy is great’ and follow and support his stories. Others get irritated and others just step back and think ‘what an idiot’.

Different ‘personas’, that’s all. If you find challenging fun, do it; if you take offence, turn a blind eye. You’re not going to get rid of the Sebs of this world

I totally agree here
I say if you make fun of people but do not degrade them it is totally fun, hell, I make fun of myself all the time. Sometimes I do find challenges fun but only as long as they are not going to far with one person feeling the need to be bigger than everyone else and becoming personal.

And of course you cannot get rid of the people like Seb and neither should we but we also cannot teach certain people to be more respectful towards each other. I usually pity people who feel the need to seem smart and better than others because most of them have problems with themselves. As I said before people who need to put others down are not healthy. And since some people think I have no idea what I am talking about because they love to call me out on my bullshit: it is exactly what psychology professors said as well: the more people feel the need to act as if they are better than others and need to show off, the more they are often (not always) deeply insecure.

bonjovi90 09-01-2019 03:28 AM

That I agree with you - this forum is not healthy, hasn't been in many years and I don't think it'll change till it completely fades into oblivion.
And I partly blame BJ for that.

Gesendet von meinem Nexus 5X mit Tapatalk

faith1985 09-01-2019 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bonjovi90 (Post 1258735)
That I agree with you - this forum is not healthy, hasn't been in many years and I don't think it'll change till it completely fades into oblivion.
And I partly blame BJ for that.

Gesendet von meinem Nexus 5X mit Tapatalk

Yes and yes. I think when something people root for becomes worse people become too.

semigoodlooking 09-02-2019 03:34 PM

This is a very tame forum, the amount of members has dwindled down to a core few. While it can get heated, it is mostly kept civilized (there are no complete outbursts of insults with no point to them). If you feel Umbrage here, you must live in an online bubble, because this place is nothing compared to social media or Reddit (as examples).

I don't think anyone who said you were talking nonesense did so without explaining why. You didn't like how you was talked to and seem to think a lot of it was empty rhetoric aimed at antagonizing you. Fair enough, opinions will vary on whether you're right or wrong.

What I don't get is why you felt the need to create a thread (this very thread)? If we all create threads when someone says something we don't like or when someone disagrees with our point of view, it would be unworkable. Seb and Evline have been going at it in this thread, should they now create an individual thread each to voice their opinion on their argument?

Also, if your intention is to leave then why tell us? Obviously the need for attention was in play otherwise you just leave.

Having said all that, you absolutley shouldn't leave. If you like Bon Jovi, this is arguably the best place to be because it is one of the few places that is challenging when discussing the band.

By the way, when discussing the narcissim, I did not say your opinion is not welcome. It absolutley is and you should continue with it. What I did say was it was demonstrably invalid and not based in fact.

thesedays2014 09-03-2019 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by semigoodlooking (Post 1258757)

By the way, when discussing the narcissim, I did not say your opinion is not welcome. It absolutley is and you should continue with it. What I did say was it was demonstrably invalid and not based in fact.

I didn’t read a lot of that thread to be honest, but it’s quite clear (from the outside) that Jon has strong narcissistic traits, just like Richie is a perfect example of an empath. The balance they once had broke and Richie left. Pretty simple.


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