The THINFS tour KICKS ASS!
 

To put it simply, I believe in Jon again. Don't get me wrong, he's still sounding rough in general, but his voice somehow seems to be improving day by day, and if the progression continues in the way it's lately been, the guy will probably be back to decent vocal shape on the European tour next year.

But even now, there's lots to like. For example, the set list might be pretty static on the first sight, but at least they've given the boot for some of the crap songs they've previously been playing in every show, or at least perform them more rarely nowadays. I don't hate Because We Can, Captain Crash or I Love This Town, but none of them is in a real need to be a live staple, and overall I can say I'm happy to see ILTT having bitten the dust. And, to be honest, Jon has made some good/rare-ish choices to be included in the set lists pretty regularly - for example, Lay Your Hands On Me (sung by Jon) hadn't been a staple since the OWN tour! The sets have a great flow in general and the crowds no longer seem to lose their interest during the concerts.

Another positive thing: although Jon's voice is shot, he seems to be much braver with it than previously and no longer dodges all the high notes he had been avoiding for years until the THINFS tour (most notably, the "lay my hands on YOOOUUU..." on LYHOM that he never went for even on the non-Richie versions from 2010-11, when his voice was in about its best post-2k shape; this tour he goes for - and nails - it every single time). His pronunciation of the lyrics has also gotten a lot better and nowadays he sings the "I wasn't there when you were happy, or there when you were down" part on IBTFY properly again instead of mumbling "AAANDEEEWEEE UUUEEE HAAAPEEE, HOONEEEWEEE UUUWEEE DAAAN". Even on Always he sings the "I'll be there 'til the stars don't shine..." part clearly again.

But, most importantly, the band seems like a band again. It's no longer just the CEO & the employees. JBJ gives both Phil and Big John lots of chances to shine, interacts both with his bandmates and the audience a lot (something that was largely absent during the latter part of the BWC tour and the 2015 Asian tour), JUMPS INTO THE CROWD FROM THE MAIN STAGE AGAIN (having pretty much stopped it after the Crush/OWN tour) etc.

Mark my words: the rest of the tour will be awesome. It was OK to good in the States, it's really good to awesome now and it will (most likely) be epic next year. Let's just not give up on Jon; the guy will get himself together again, he's a trooper. The band seems to genuinely enjoy performing for the first time in quite a number of years, even the static set lists are good (at least) for a change and as Jon's vocals improve, the band will probably bring out some real goodies again.

JBJ might still be just halfway there, but he'll make it, I swear. Just keep the faith!

I will mark your words and show it to you the next time Jon butchers a super easy song and you will look really stupid.

There's zero evidence to suspect a substantial improvement in the vocals department in comparison to the NA leg.

Don't talk like that or Rdkopper will attack you within a few minutes! Someone like you, who has only ripped the band's albums for years and hasn't enjoyed anything since These Days isn't entitled to such a drastic point of view!!! :mrgreen:

I can't tell if this is satire or not!

Mmmm no. I appreciate your enthusiasm (if you are not being sarcastic) and I do agree with some of your points, but no, just no. The recipe to having a band in 2017 that resembles the old BJ (give or take a co-writer, co-producer, co-responsible of delivering a great show, co-singer, and founding member) is super easy and it doesn’t have anything to do with Jon’s voice.

The shows were always fun. The last time I saw them (I’m almost afraid to say it was in 2008, I’m almost 10 years behind, not sure if I can call myself “a dedicated fan”) I was absolutely aware that Jon had trouble with some songs and his voice was weak in some parts. Being there with 50.000+ screaming fans and having a blast wasn’t incompatible with having perfectly working ears. But I didn’t care, it was a fun show. The band used to have fun on stage and the fans enjoyed that above the perfect rendition of their favorite song. Was all the banter scripted? WHO THE HELL CARES, it’s their job to entertain people.

Today, I see a band going through the motions.
Most of the time it looks like an excellent tribute band working their asses off to deliver their best to compensate for Jon’s shortcomings. It’s not the band’s fault, I’m sure their relationship is easier now than it was on the last tour and the years before. But if Jon can’t or won’t be the frontman he used to be, the show is just a pale imitation of what it was and the band is just there… doing their job. It’s Jon and the BJ guys and some other people.

There are lots of easy, doable things that Jon can do to improve the show: Bring back the medleys and have the silly banter, who cares if it’s scripted down to the last word. Don’t have a damn catwalk and use it only once. Bring back the speeches between the songs (that was actually a highlight of this tour). Interact at least with the original members, I can understand why Jon is reluctant to pretend that losing 50% of what made the band great is not a big deal and he could treat Phil and Shanks as if they were Richie and expect fans not to complain. It is a good decision even though the show will never be the same, it's a compromise and I'm OK with it. But c’mon include Dave, my poor Dave, he’s always picture perfect at the back, waiting for a chance to shine. Give the guy something to do, like they've done many times in the past. Those things require 0 effort and have always been done. And will improve the show whether Jon's voice continues to decline or not.

What I agree is that from the band’s perspective it is indeed a good tour. Good reviews, they left behind their worst moment and bounced back again (sorry, I couldn't resist the horrible pun), the future looks promising...

This.

I can't understand why Jon stopped doing all the fun gimmicks he used to when his voice was still good. He should be even more reliant on those now that he can't please us with his voice, but it's the opposite. It probably due to confidence issues that come from not being able to deliver as a vocalist.

You're missing my point... People continue to bash Jon show after show because of his voice and trust me, I know it's shit... And it's not getting better. I'll be the first to say it...

Jon is not a lazy guy. He's got great work ethics and still runs/works out everyday... Why anyone would think that he doesn't care about his voice or stands at the mic as a sign of laziness is beyond me... Personally I think with this new Bon Jovi band, Jon is taking a darker approach... He's changing things up a little while keeping it the same, just like the way he changes things up with each album... I also think Jon performs in pain every night and when the show is over, his throat is on fire.

The people who bash Jon are selecting a few of the most difficult songs and ripping him a new asshole like he's a criminal. And it seems to be the same people who don't support the band.

Why does everyone who attends shows have different opinions? Everyone!!! I admit that 2013 was an autopilot glorified cover band with Jon as the lead singer.... And rightfully understandable too. All the new songs work well live. This House is a great opener, Knockout is fantastic, etc... Watching These Days and then judging the entire tour based off of that is not fair and those are the opinions I don't value.

In short, I value people's opinions who understand the band... Who understand the big picture. It's the people who buy the albums and attend the shows... Those are the educated fans who are deeper than "I listened to These Days, Jon Sucks, It's Over"!

You can thank Richie Sambora for that... Don't blame Jon...

And come on! It's more than a tribute band... Phil and EB are cool... Shanks is even cooler than Bobby too... They get better with each show...

Jon used to talk a lot about his cousin Captain Crash. Now he doesn't even mention him anymore, how rude

How about no. While Phil will never be treated like Richie because he is not Richie, Dave is still Dave, Tico is still Tico and even poor Hughie is still poor Hughie, the forgotten middle child. Jon has interacted with them plenty of times before.

Please!!! Hughie is doing just fine... He's the chilled out studio musician converted into the touring one...

For anyone to call this current line up a glorified cover band, don't forget who caused a this... That wonderful musician who is about to put out his Valentine Day album with his sweetheart... That would be the perfect release date bty...

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I'm pretty sure that glorified lead singer had his fair share in the reasons for Richie's abscence as well.

I'm sorry - I strongly apologize for actually enjoying the current tour more than I expected. However, for me the easy songs (Knockout, Because We Can, Who Says, God Bless This Mess, Captain Crash) are the ones that Jon seems to struggle the most with. He's somewhat decent (by post-2011 standards) on Bed Of Roses, Always (judging by the three renditions we've gotten this year so far - and no, not even the LA version was "terrible" in my opinion), Lay Your Hands On Me, Wanted and Blood On Blood. Even It's My Life, In These Arms, Have A Nice Day, Keep The Faith and Bad Medicine sound quite a bit better nowadays than they did from late '13 to '15 (although Jon's vocals on them are still pretty poor in general). Out of the new songs, he often seems to be out of breath on Roller Coaster, but he usually still does a decent job on it overall. However, his vocals on We Don't Run are atrociously weak pretty much every time. Overall, I wouldn't say his voice is necessarily "shot" - it's extremely inconsistent, and that, in my opinion, is very sad. At times he sounds like the JBJ of old and at times like a 80-year-old karaoke singer. I can't even imagine how frustrated the poor guy must be.

PS. Jon screamed during KTF in Porto Alegre. What about that?

Maybe so... And I don't necessarily fault Richie for leaving... I just fault him for the way he did it... If he actually finished the tour, THINF might be a JBJ Solo album instead of a band album right now...

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I'm sorry but I do not buy this. Jon is far from giving a good show, and it bothers me to say it seriously. I have come to a point with myself that I wish the best for this band, even with Shanks and Phil on the boat. But they are far from good, not even solid. It's a shame, other bands of his age, who have also been worn out over the years, are tourning making shows more solid, very good, and it gives me a bit of anger and sadness that Jon can not regain some solidity in its performances, because he was the best doing that, the magic moments, I have never looked for the perfect performance in a live show, always treated to value more of that magic and passion in the show, that is completely lost now, and I want it to return.

My hope is in the work of studio. I think Jon loves to do albums, and that's fantastic, I must admit that there are a good number of BB and THINFS songs that I love, so I hope this is not the end, just a bump in the road, and continue making albums.

As for tours, as I not able to enjoy the show, hopefully someday he find that thing that was lost live (and I don't mean Sambora), I hope it is also smarter and their tours they are shorter, I think that 1 year of tour is well, they do not have to stretch during 2 years.

"Jon is improving". That's good news."The setlist is decent". Another good news."Performances getting better each show". That's good news again.
"Positive reviews are all over the place". Somewhat suprising but still good news.


Other than these four impressive positives, there are still a lot of things that confuses me the most. I mean Phil X and Dave can hype the crowd up if they're just given the chance to take the stage. The band is not even having fun. They look like they're having a band session at a funeral. Onstage interactions with the band members is pretty rare on this tour. And also, the man's mobility. He is not moving. If he is, then probably on songs like WGIGO, LYHOM and BM. Lastly I think I'm the only here who hates the acoustic version of Saturday Night. The version destroyed the song's mood. And those speeches and adlibs? Where are these extras now?!



Despite with these negatives,I am now satisfied on what the band has right now, my previous views to them might be inconsistent but judging on what the band shows right now takes away those inconsistent views of mine. Jon is climbing his way up to improvement, and I would not be surprised if he delivers much much better on the next leg.

You lot could start an argument in an empty room.

These South American shows have been the best live performances post Richie IMO. If you can't see Jon is improving show by show, it's just plain ignorance. Obviously the voice is never going to recover properly but let's just enjoy the ride while we still can.

I'm looking forward to seeing them next year in Europe personally. I think there are a lot of reasons to be positive. Phil is just as much part of the band as Dave, Tico, and Hugh now for me.

On a side note, after hearing RSO, I wouldn't want Richie anywhere near the band. It is truly, truly atrocious.



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I would be pissed if I'd paid to see this tour so far tbh... yes things are getting better but there's so many better live bands I could spend my money on right now. Until the guys start moving their asses the CD's are much better quality.

This has to be a joke.

This tour is awful. The obvious part being Jon has never sounded worse. That's being generous. I find him unlistenable. The big, black dude with the stupid grin on his face for 2 hours banging a the cowbell, Jon Shanks, the set list (as usual). I've seen the band over 50 times. This was the worst show I've ever seen (or heard). I blame a lot of Richie not being there. The whole sound of the band has changed (for the worse). I think mentally, Jon is a bit lost up there without Richie.

All of that said, the biggest shame of this is I think the THINFS album, for the most part, is excellent.

Danfan, it really wasn't awful... Jon showed significant improvement on many songs and even had highlighted moments... Don't be those close-minded fans who watch a highlight or two of the most difficult songs in the catalog and base your opinion of the entire tour on that...

I'll ask you to watch a few great moments from Sao Paulo so you can get an accurate opinion instead of just spewing nonsense with no backing...

1. The second half of Saturday Night after Jon's speech...

2. The last 3 minutes of These Days

3. Bed Of Roses

4. Bad Medicine

Watch those videos on YouTube and then come back with a real opinion besides the 'The Big Black Dude Banging A Cowbell"...

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But to be fair - these are pretty much the only real "highlights" of 2017 and, while the band and Jon definitely have shown some improvement and he at least has a bit of showmanship back, even these performances maybe are at level with some mid-2013 performances and still far away from what was delivered up until 2011.
I'm all for them to fight their way back, but danfan said that he had seen about 50 shows of this band and the most recent one was the worst. Even if I had chosen to see the ones in Rio or Sao Paulo I would have come to the same conclusion. They still weren't a match to what I had seen in Germany in 2013 where they already had Phil X on board.

The Sao Paulo show wasn't so much about his vocals being great for me, let's face it, they are still pretty (and sometimes very) rough. I was looking forward to watching the Rock In Rio show after reading peoples comments but I found it for most parts awful vocally.

What brought some belief in this band back to me after seeing the Sao Paulo was Jon acting like a rock star again for some moments during the show. Not only the obvious acts like the Saturday Night ad-lib, the These Days outro or the Bed of Roses. For me it felt unbelievable to see Jon work the stage on songs like Bad Name, Born To Be My Baby, It's My Life, Have a Nice Day, Prayer etc. Songs we couldn't have dreamt of Jon leaving his mic stand on a few months back. On some vidoes where the audience drowns Jons voice it relly felt for brief moments like putting the clock back five years or so.

Let's face it, the North American part of the tour was truly awful, let's not let the relative improvement in South America change that.

Unfortunately it always seems to be the way that the NA Arena leg gets horrible static vanilla setlists. Combine that with Jon struggling vocally and barely moving and it's worse than anything. If I was a fan in the US I wouldn't call the tour a triumph by any means.

However, as a fan in Europe, and used to the stadium shows and setlists that we get, I'm heartened by the improvement shown in the last couple of shows and hope that extends going forward. The vocals might be shot, but they are getting to a slightly more acceptable level and the band are sounding good. Rock In Rio is a show I'm actually happy to watch again, rather than the earlier shows watching with some grim determination to see how bad it is.