Is Jon singing slower?
 

I've noticed from the soundboard recordings that the songs sound very slow. Even the new ones.

From the little I know about music, I think the instruments have not been toned down more than the habitual so it has to be Jon (or my ears)

He seems to be phrasing (?) very deliberately, skipping entire words instead of the weird pronunciation he did in the past when he was mashing words and sounds together. This seems to make his singing slower but still in sync with the instruments and it's probably helping his breathing also.

Or I'm just hallucinating :p

I think he is ...

The way he is singing really bothers me ... His tone is horrible, and he doesn't sing naturally ... He's really strugling ...

Yes, that's a new one and I don't like it at all. The song loses energy that way, it's like slowing down everything. You can't do that on (example) Bad Medicine....

Check this


Jon is out of sync in some moments which can be intentional but it gives the impression of a second rate tribute band

It sounds like he's out of breath.

He started being out of breath and out of sync a lot in the summer of 2013 before his voice went rapidly downhill. I hope it's not an indication of the same.

Nailed it! My thoughts exactly...

He doesn't sound extremely out of breath to me. In 2015 he was during the whole song and it didn't seem as if it was a conscious choice to sing slower. I could be wrong though, I've only watched a few videos from that tour but I remember a spectacularly bad IML in that regard. Current IML is ok-ish, at least he's in sync.

Besides, how could he be out of breath if he's singing like every fifth word of the chorus? And it's BTBMB ffs. If he can't sing BTBMB, just call it a day. I've heard better drunken karaoke singing :(

Slowing down and skipping words may be a choice to preserve his voice/stamina during the show, but he's having trouble keeping in sync at least here and he shouldn't. I've heard Wanted and it was very very slow as well so either you are right and it's a breathing problem or he just run out of gas for the encore.

Wow, Jon is horrible here, probably one of the worst BTBMB I've heard :(

Also, those Na Na Nas is just wrong... If I would have closed my eyes and listened I would never guess that was Bon Jovi live.

That's the problem I have, they are too removed now. The loss of Sambora, the loss of Jon's voice, the slower tempo, the rearrangement of songs, they sound like a bad tribute act. Jon's charisma is shot too. They just aren't a draw for me anymore. I have very fond memories of this bad live and I think seeing them like this if they come over to the UK again will sully the good memories somewhat.

I didn't hate THINFS the album, so maybe that's all this band will be for me. Ow, studio albums and past work.

I couldn't agree more. And I wonder if this tour will be their last regular one. I remember reading one of the posts here on the board that BJ would have to tour once again with the post Sambora material... I don't think Jon will ever settle for small venues and another big tours will be just out of reach. This tour is one hell of an experiment and only time will tell what the future holds.

Nailed it.

European crowds won't be as forgiving either.

Has Jon's voice really deserted him and gone? It may sound a silly question given his known struggles in the last few years. The only reason I ask this is because of that Karaoke segment just before THINFS was released. Jon sounded unbelievably good, even hitting the higher notes to a degree. I'm not dumb enough to think there aren't other factors involved but could it be somewhat down to confidence?

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I think that actually a lot of it is psychological. Of course his vocals have deteriorated heavily in the past few years. But there are moments where he seems to forget about the problems and sounds more natural and actually better. Like the karaoke show you mentioned or when he entered the audience during Bad Medicine. There he seemed to had regained a bit of his old self. And at the karaoke show he was seen taking some whiskey shots before so he may have been more relaxed.
Someone mentioned in one of the countless threads about Jon's voice that he fails to keep the newer technique for the whole show since his body stiffens up. I think that may be one of the reasons. On this tour, if you play close attention, you can actually see him "walking" sometimes while hanging on to the microphone. It's like he tries to counteract the tension in his muscles there.

Jon's been a lead singer for so many years, got loads of experience and how come he suddenly has problems with low self-esteem on stage?! It's like he developed a phobia of open spaces and crowds which can't be the case because he just won't play in small venues again, at least not regularly. So what's that x factor that made him so vulnerable and scared?!

Low self esteem on stage? What are you talking about? A person that is performing at a concert then goes out to the crowd and sings to them to me does not qualify low self esteem, or is that your definition of low self esteem? And what phobia of open spaces and crowds are you talking about?

Some folks here suggest Jon having problems with self-confidence and that it affects his voice making it a vicious circle. What psychological issues can the man have then?

He's talked about psychological reasons for his vocal problems before the tour. Not in detail, but I guess that since he went through some sort of depression it must've affected his usage of his voice as well. At least to some degree. Remember that he stated numerous times that he "couldn't even sing in the shower anymore". He most likely had lost his confidence in his voice and consequently the secureness of knowing that he can entertain a crowd in the way that he used to do. So in the end I guess low self esteem really was a factor.

and yet, he went on tour? is it trying too hard (he's nothing to prove, yeah right) or fighting against the odds (not giving up whatever the real reasons are)?

Initially it was (as he admitted himself) just "to make some money" and maybe fight the odds. Later on I think he tried to regain his passion for performing.

thank you! :)

I saw an article recently about an opera singer (male) who went through a divorce and other issues in his personal life, and literally one night on stage, he just couldn't sing. His ex wife was also an opera singer with him, and he just could suddenly no longer sing. At all.
It's an interesting read, I can find the article if you're interested ...
Anyway, it took this guy a few months until he could sing again. All psychological.

I will always think the same thing, back in 2013 with all the Richie tension and later Tico's surgery, he started smoking again, he smoked for a lot of years, when you are smoker and you quit and you go through a huge emocional stress, your body just craves nicotine, you may not use it but I think he did. The cigarrettes plus his depression, I think just made him shot his voice, as far as I know, the vocal chords of a singer are like strings on a guitar, if you don't play, they go out of tune, Jon said that he couldn't sing anything for months in one of the Runaway Trips...

I don't know what's caused Jon's voice problems- so many issues going on - but it has to be devastating for him and it took a lot to get back on the stage for the THINFS tour.

I'm sure he feels the struggle when singing and after being such a vocal powerhouse when younger it had to be very frustrating and scary to know it's probably never coming back.

He's not one to give up so who knows what's next??


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IDK since you were the one who suggested this, maybe you would know. Seriously, IDK where you guys come with these crazy theories! If Jon had "personal issues" now do u think he would be touring again? From what I have seen on YT, and heard from people here who attended the shows this past tour, he was energetic, happy, having a good time, and the band was playing at its peak.

have all the opinions you want, but this is wrong.

So you don't think David, Tico, PhilX, and the rest of the band were not performing up to par?

They were playing great but to say it's the best the band has ever sounded entirely subjective. It's not something a lot of people will agree with though. At least musically. With vocals it's nothing like it was.

This is so subjective,it's not even debatable...

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Whether you like it or not, there is a math to music. Making it not "completely" subjective.

1) Tico's playing has become less intense, and is playing quieter. This is of course natural due to his age. However, he is no longer at his peak. The volume and intensity of Tico's playing is not subjective.
2) The musicianship and overall integrity of the song have decreased. There is a way more formulic stucture to their music, making it much easier to replicate than normal. Things such as pinch harmonics are missing.
3) Jon's vocals have degraded to the point of him singing off key for a lot of songs. Singing off key is not a "subjective" thing.
4) Incantation of lyrics are worse. Less syllables being sung means parts of the original song is lost. That's not subjective.
5) Complete lack of variation of setlists, even with shows in the same city. This is the worst it has ever been. Again, this is a fact and not subjective.

peak: reach a highest point, either of a specified value or at a specified time.

This is NOT Bon Jovi playing at their peak.

Yeah saying it's the best quality it's ever been falls somewhere in between. If you're saying it's the best it's ever been for you then no one can say otherwise. If someone is saying they're at their peak it's going to set off some debate. I commend that they're still going and putting on shows people have a blast at but to say they're at their peak is a bit much.

Facts, not opinions *me likes* BJ are past their peak but so are most of the bands anyway. At least they are not stuck in the 80s and try to reinvent themselves to a different point of success every time they record a new thing. Failed attempts do happen (WAN anyone?) but overall, they still have it.

I think WAN was ok, but I would consider it a "low point" musically for them. It was'nt horrible, but I think they were not in there A game, the album to me seemed forced, and personally, I think Jon and Richie were might be having issues already, musically I would think. Richie, to me, was just not into it, but went ahead anyway, but the important thing is now the band has regrouped and focused, whether some here may like this new direction or not, Jon did not give up, neither has David or Tico.

Richie didn't give up on music! I'm damn sure he will be on stage as long as he can play the guitar. Whatever issues are hindering the release of his solo album, he's still very much there on stage doing gigs and jamming with friends. I've read countless stories of band members leaving and reuniting with their old bands but they were never out of work. Thank God for Richie's solo stuff, I'm forever grateful for the music.

I didn't mean he gave up music in general, I think he just wasn't happy with the direction of the band was going musically, which led him to leave the band

I remember thinking when WAN came out, that there were many articles about JBJ being short the capital to invest in the Buffalo Bills move to Toronto fiasco. NFL doesn't allow companies to have majority ownership in the team and Rogers (Who he teamed up with) as well as the other partner (Larry Tanenbaum) have much more than JBJ's reported $300 Mil net worth. (900m total was short of the reported 1.1B price tag on the franchise)

I always had in the back of my mind that the entire WAN album and tour came out when the band had said a break was coming. It led me to think it might have something to do with JBJ and his net worth.

Im not judging and don't really care either way, but when you think that both Richie and Tico both publically said they didn't want to tour and they still did it. All with the story of JBJ's interest in an NFL team being in the background.

Its a possiblity, but I was say in retrospect now, maybe this WAN album and tour may have backfired at Jon. Not that I am critizing that he wanted to buy and NFL team, which was a dream of his for a while, but if he would have gone a different way about it, maybe he would have not had to make another record or tour, because I do beleive that David, Tico, and even Richie were not into it at that point. But it is what it is. Jon took the bait and went through some emotional moments because of this, and had to learn some hard lessons, but I think he learned from his mistakes and has moved on.

Buying a NFL team is quite the undertaking. He certainly went big on that one but I guess the payoff is great. I don't know much about football but would think he'd have to give up music for quite awhile?


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I can't believe someone has said this is Bon Jovi at their peak.

Actually, it was Rosa, so I can.

Read some stupid stuff on this forum before but **** me, that's topped it.

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So if you thought what I wrote was stupid, fine, I will proudly take that as a compliment! ;)