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Supersonic 07-10-2020 07:03 AM

Rate: American Reckoning
 
Aloha !

I think it's the first decent song in years. It's clear there's no band behind him anymore to help with the arrangements though. It's a shame the music's not allowed to breathe more, the harmonica solo could break things open but it doesn't. It's why songs produced like this are forgettable, the arrangement isn't surprising or entertaining enough to keep me listening and wanting to hear it again. The chorus isn't that great with your usual "stay alive, stand your ground" nonsense that needs to be in every Bon Jovi song. I've also got a hard time listening to Jon sing on studio records, the way he pronounces some words sound like he's had a stroke at times. Overall, still not bad and it sounds a lot more honest than drivel like Knockout.

6/10

Salaam Aleikum,
Sebastiaan

liljovi93 07-10-2020 07:14 AM

I think that's the first time I've ever read someone say something is decent then just give negative points [emoji23]

I don't disagree, though.

The lyrics are the best thing about it. The harmonica solo seemed a bit out of place on my first listen but when I got the chance to sit down and listen, it fits quite well.

Jon's delivery is what's letting a lot of songs down now. Hardly any key changes, the melody doesn't pick up, the chorus is whiny and quite hard for me to enjoy.

4/10 for me.

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danfan 07-10-2020 07:48 AM

I don't know if it's because it feels forced, but I don't care for it at all. I won't get into the arrangement. No point anymore. Can't imagine I would even listen to this a 2nd time.

steel_horse75 07-10-2020 09:12 AM

Rate: American Reckoning
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Supersonic (Post 1265319)
Aloha !

I think it's the first decent song in years. It's clear there's no band behind him anymore to help with the arrangements though. It's a shame the music's not allowed to breathe more, the harmonica solo could break things open but it doesn't. It's why songs produced like this are forgettable, the arrangement isn't surprising or entertaining enough to keep me listening and wanting to hear it again. The chorus isn't that great with your usual "stay alive, stand your ground" nonsense that needs to be in every Bon Jovi song. I've also got a hard time listening to Jon sing on studio records, the way he pronounces some words sound like he's had a stroke at times. Overall, still not bad and it sounds a lot more honest than drivel like Knockout.

6/10

Salaam Aleikum,
Sebastiaan


Pretty much this.

Again, like the last few albums the production reeks of shanks. Jon’s voice isn’t great, thought it was Willie Nelson singing at first. I like the harmonica as it’s something different.

It’s the best out of the 4 we’ve heard so far (not that the other 3 were any competition) but it’s another song I won’t be buying. Thats 3 on the bounce now. I only bought unbroken for the cause, listened once. Never again.

I guess this is modern day Bon Jovi now. But it’s not for me. Springsteen and Dylan do this type of song much better.

Glad those who enjoy do.

Dreading the album from what we’ve heard so far.

4/10 - decent effort by modern day standards.


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nickolai 07-10-2020 09:13 AM

It is not something I will ever listen to. It’s utter drivel.

If Jon put the whole band behind it and had an “undivided” feel to it, it could be more tolerable. It’s just boring and the lyrics are mediocre at best.

2/10


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YOVANAfromPeru 07-10-2020 09:40 AM

4/10.
In this song JBJ's voice doesn't sound awkward like in Do What You Can... but it's too slow for my taste.
I like more Limitless, then this one, Do What You Can and lastly Unbroken.
No way I'm gonna download this song on iTunes, sorry.

Bounce7800 07-10-2020 10:19 AM

5/10.

Treating it as a bonus track and something extra. Its not something I'd choose to listen to as it's pretty dull, despite being lyrically good. It's why I'm not one of those who think Jon should go into acoustic storyteller mode as it will just end up with monotone dreary songs.

But kudos for giving us something extra, out of nowhere, and tying into current events for 2020. Just not for me.

Thinny 07-10-2020 10:27 AM

6/10

I agree that this is the best thing We've heard from them in 2020. I like the lyrics, but they read better than they play out in the song. I guess it's Jon's delivery again. It is very Spingsteen, but that's no bad thing. I think that this is exactly the kind of music Jon should be doing nowadays, but as a JBJ solo project, not as the band.

I can understand why some people might find it boring, but as someone suggested in another thread, I don't think this would work as a high octane "I Believe" style rocker at all. I think the stripped back approach really works for this song.

The only thing I've really enjoyed from the band this year really. I still can't stand Unbroken, Limitless grew on me a little, but was more of the same formula we've been getting over and over and We Do What We Can was just ok at best.

james_d 07-10-2020 10:41 AM

I enjoy the song, I've been generous and given it a 7, certainly agree that it's more of a JBJ song than BJ one. Certainly good lyrics etc, and I do like the harmonica a lot. But yeah, I don't know how much I'll actually listen to it, as music is often a way to get away from the world for me more than anything else.

rolo_tomachi 07-10-2020 10:58 AM

I like the theme of the song, but the lyrics and melody repeat a little in those four and a half minutes. The harmonica is the best... I wish there had been more harmony in this. Feeling that it will fit very well into the album.

TheOriginalJez 07-10-2020 12:30 PM

We're now witnessing the final stages of Jon's carefully staged transformation into a lesser Springsteen... I mean a harmonica solo? Ok Bruce...

As a track it's fine, it's ok. It's better than that crappy one he did about soldiers last year. But Bruce Springsteen already exists, and he's better at being Bruce Springsteen than Jon is so... meh.

eddie73 07-10-2020 01:22 PM

Remember when bonus tracks were better than songs that made the cut ?

We have come to this, not sure why people think the harmonica solo is so great, its really not ! lyrics are pretty good but are nothing without a decent melody which is lacking....its a track that will get skipped by me when the album is released and if it gets played live I'm off to the bar.

Boring song , just not what I want to hear from a so called rock n roll band

its a 3 for me and that's being kind

NicoRourke 07-10-2020 03:05 PM

I couldn't listen till the end.

His voice is just unbearable live, and unbearably boring in the studio. Plus once again those god damn lyrics in the chorus. There were a few good and moving lines in the verses though, and the harmonica is a nice change.

The absence of Richie at this point is just too big the void is immense.

bjcrazycpa 07-10-2020 03:26 PM

Because I read comments here before listening, my expectation was to hate it lol! But, after one listen, I actually like it. The repetitive guitar melody I dig, it's soothing. And the harmonica makes the song for me. Downsides, are as Seb mentioned, his pronunciation is a bit weird at times and has that sound of too much spit building up. 7/10 for me.


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Matrix15 07-10-2020 05:09 PM

I find it hard to judge because it's so contemporary, and it would be so easy to cock up a song about such a sensitive subject matter. That said, I think Jon sounds genuine and I believe what he sings.

The other route would have been the 'undivided' style pissed-off with the state of the world rocker. I think that worked for 9/11 subject matter because it started with such as massive event, thousands lost their lives and it called for a loud anthem. However, I think in this case Jon called it right to have it much slower and stripped down. The lyrics are the focus of the song and he can tell the story of George Floyd in a solemn and respectful way.

It's not going to be one I have on endless repeat, but I think it does what Jon intended it to do. It's also nice to see him pull out the harmonica again.

Butters 07-10-2020 06:05 PM

I gave it an 8/10. The lyrics are surprisingly good. It would have been so easy to get this wrong and fall into bland cliches but I think Jon did a really nice job.

The melody is not spectacular but I like it, and I have no issue with the quieter approach. The harmonica was a lovely surprise.

The song is let down massively by Jon's vocals. I know there is nothing to be done and his voice is what it is but it is so frustrating to know what this could have sounded like if he could sing like himself from 10 years ago.

Good song. Nothing spectacular, and unfortunately I think we'll never get a classic again given the state of his voice.

Alphavictim 07-10-2020 06:43 PM

Gave it a 6/10. The highlights are the verses, the lyrics and the harmonica part. I think it does exactly what it should do, in terms of atmosphere. Chorus falls flat in terms of lyrics and vocals. Lyrically, the song as a whole is certainly a hell of a lot better than Jon's overtly "political songs" of the past, so that was a pleasant surprise.

Of course, knowing the history of the band, it still sounds like something that he should present to the band, then have a certain co-writing partner fix the chorus, work out a more dynamic arrangement with them all, and then record a stunning performance. But it is what it is and it is what we're gonna get. The reason the verses work so well is because they are in a range JBJ is still convincing in.

phoenixy 07-10-2020 06:48 PM

Anyone could help me out, what's the meaning of this?
I just don't get it.:(
"And I'll never have to have the talk
So it don't happen to you"

faith1985 07-10-2020 07:09 PM

9/10

I am not too keen on the military metaphors but I am not American. There is something that haunts me about the building right before the harmonica solo. It breaths more than most Jovi songs and for the harmonica itself I would give it a 8, some of the lyrics made me very emotional.

The only thing I don't like is the repetition in the chorus, the rest is totaly my thing.

I believe every word comes from deep down.

Oh, and look how greedy Jon is: he donates it all ;-).

faith1985 07-10-2020 07:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phoenixy (Post 1265368)
Anyone could help me out, what's the meaning of this?
I just don't get it.:(
"And I'll never have to have the talk
So it don't happen to you"

It means Jon says he is not black so he does not have the talk from his dad saying how to behave to - for example - not getting pulled over by the police.

Adam D 07-10-2020 07:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phoenixy (Post 1265368)
Anyone could help me out, what's the meaning of this?

I just don't get it.:(

"And I'll never have to have the talk

So it don't happen to you"

Jon, as a white man, is commenting on the fact that he will never have to have the talk with his kids in the same way that black parents have to have with theirs.

Black parents have to look at the police differently than almost any other race in the US. I can't imagine what it must be like to have to train your kids, basically from birth, to be wary of the police and law enforcement.

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phoenixy 07-10-2020 07:53 PM

Thank you (both of you)!
It's clear now.

RonJovi 07-10-2020 10:04 PM

I was surprised to see so many say the lyrics are great. The first verse is garbage and rehashes a load of ideas/lyrics from previous songs. However, while I dismissed the lyrics on that basis, the rest is pretty good.

I like it. It’s a pretty good effort given the subject matter. It’s not memorable or anything but it’s decent.

It’s not Bon Jovi though for me. It’s Jon trying to be Dylan and that’s not why I love this band. Jon isn’t even a pale imitation of Dylan (or Bruce) so he should stop trying. He made it on writing songs that the average person could relate to. Songs that captured how everyman/everywoman was feeling. No one did it better.

Maybe he’s grown up but if he has, that doesn’t mean he has the lyrical dexterity to write about subjects like this well.

Captain_jovi 07-10-2020 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RonJovi (Post 1265374)
I was surprised to see so many say the lyrics are great. The first verse is garbage and rehashes a load of ideas/lyrics from previous songs. However, while I dismissed the lyrics on that basis, the rest is pretty good.

I like it. It’s a pretty good effort given the subject matter. It’s not memorable or anything but it’s decent.

It’s not Bon Jovi though for me. It’s Jon trying to be Dylan and that’s not why I love this band. Jon isn’t even a pale imitation of Dylan (or Bruce) so he should stop trying. He made it on writing songs that the average person could relate to. Songs that captured how everyman/everywoman was feeling. No one did it better.

Maybe he’s grown up but if he has, that doesn’t mean he has the lyrical dexterity to write about subjects like this well.

But I feel like he's always had this side of him before. There are a handful of songwriter-y songs in the catalouge, at varying levels of quality we'll say haha, that this vibe fits perfectly.

I'm curious what songs you meant that this rehashes? As far as turns of phrase goes, Shine a light has been used before but the rest feels pretty specific to the incident. I'm not defending the song by any means, just curious.

Alphavictim 07-10-2020 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RonJovi (Post 1265374)
I was surprised to see so many say the lyrics are great. The first verse is garbage and rehashes a load of ideas/lyrics from previous songs. However, while I dismissed the lyrics on that basis, the rest is pretty good.

I like it. It’s a pretty good effort given the subject matter. It’s not memorable or anything but it’s decent.

It’s not Bon Jovi though for me. It’s Jon trying to be Dylan and that’s not why I love this band. Jon isn’t even a pale imitation of Dylan (or Bruce) so he should stop trying. He made it on writing songs that the average person could relate to. Songs that captured how everyman/everywoman was feeling. No one did it better.

Maybe he’s grown up but if he has, that doesn’t mean he has the lyrical dexterity to write about subjects like this well.

Do you really feel that this song is going for a distanced analysis? It is still very much about the perspective of the everyman looking at that situation.

Captain_jovi 07-10-2020 10:47 PM

If anything he's gone from writing about things an every man can relate to, to pretty flat out saying "I can't relate to this but it's still terrible that everything is shit". I really....like that it's not shrouded in metaphors. I didn't think he'd have the balls to support this movement publicly because of the fanbase but I think it's great he didn't play the middle-ground card.

RonJovi 07-10-2020 11:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alphavictim (Post 1265379)
Do you really feel that this song is going for a distanced analysis? It is still very much about the perspective of the everyman looking at that situation.

True but that’s not really my point. The big hits, “Prayer”, “Bad Name”, “IBTFY”, “Bed of Roses”, “In These Arms”, TAALS”, “IML” we’re all songs that people could personally relate to and apply to their lives. This is a song about an incident and situation that everyone has an opinion on but that most people aren’t personally effected by.

Even BJ’s better post 2000 songs (IML, Just Older, MAM, HAND, WLOL, AOD, LWTG) are songs that I can personally relate to.

This sort of song doesn’t do much for me to be honest. It’s decent, some of the lyrics are surprisingly good but other people do this sort of song much better and Jon does other sorts of songs much better than he does this kind of thing.

RonJovi 07-10-2020 11:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Captain_jovi (Post 1265378)
But I feel like he's always had this side of him before. There are a handful of songwriter-y songs in the catalouge, at varying levels of quality we'll say haha, that this vibe fits perfectly.

I'm curious what songs you meant that this rehashes? As far as turns of phrase goes, Shine a light has been used before but the rest feels pretty specific to the incident. I'm not defending the song by any means, just curious.

Are there many from the glory days though? It’s something he seems to have developed in the last 10-15 years.

“America’s on fire” instantly had me thinking of THINFS (“The streets are on fire”).

“I can’t breathe” he used as recently as Unbroken. I’m sure he’s used it in other songs as well.

The bits in between are trying to sound more clever than they are. They’re sort of empty words to me.

There are other bits I liked. “When did a judge and jury become a badge and a knee” sort of stopped me in my tracks. The rest is pretty good lyrically. First verse just grates on me a bit.

Rdkopper 07-10-2020 11:50 PM

I'll give the song a 5 out of 10.

Let me just note for the record that regardless of political views, George Floyd's death was beyond tragic however I'm just reviewing the song itself, not the written content.

Negatives:
1. Not only has Jon been lowering the keys, singing in one note, he's now basically talking the verses and even semi talking the chorus... But the Stones made a career out of it so why not?

2. His speech... The way he pronounces certain words like "Badge". He's also slurry / spitting words. He really needs a new vocal coach to reset him.

3. No Real Melody, No Hooks, Nothing to grab you.

4. The songs been done already. As I stated a few times now, it's a Bruce song from 20 years ago.

Positive:
1. The Production: Considering it was done virtually, the sound came out pretty good. It's not just killed with Shanks overproduction.

2. It's better than Do What You Can - which might be the single worst song Jon has ever done. Joey and Working Man are masterpieces compared to that one.

Neutral:
1. It's 2013 again when Jon put those two Stand Up Guy songs on What About Now as bonus tracks... I feel like we're back to that again... Same feel...Some fans embraced it, some hated it, and others were neutral.

2. The Lyrics. I was a day behind everyone (or at least a few hours) and based on everyone's reviews, I was expected to be blow away. I've always said that Jon's strength to this very day are his lyrics so they are not bad by any means but they aren't off the charts either. "The Spirits, The Intoxicate Me, I Watch Them Infiltrate My Soul" are bad ass lyrics.



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Captain_jovi 07-10-2020 11:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RonJovi (Post 1265382)
Are there many from the glory days though? It’s something he seems to have developed in the last 10-15 years.

“America’s on fire” instantly had me thinking of THINFS (“The streets are on fire”).

“I can’t breathe” he used as recently as Unbroken. I’m sure he’s used it in other songs as well.

The bits in between are trying to sound more clever than they are. They’re sort of empty words to me.

There are other bits I liked. “When did a judge and jury become a badge and a knee” sort of stopped me in my tracks. The rest is pretty good lyrically. First verse just grates on me a bit.

Fair enough, I see where you're coming from. For what it's worth, I was under the under the impression he's using "I can't breathe" in this instance due to George Floyd's last words etc. I think taking issue with X on fire twice is a bit of a stretch but I get it.

It is for sure hollow in points but I fall into the camp where I'd rather something specific than universal. I genuinely can't take another empty, universal song. He can write those in his sleep at this point. Get off your knees, sparks and fires, blind men can see, raise your hand. Sincerely, I'm done with it. It doesn't make this song better but it makes it hit harder.

Captain_jovi 07-10-2020 11:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rdkopper (Post 1265383)
I'll give the song a 5 out of 10.

Let me just note for the record that regardless of political views, George Floyd's death was beyond tragic however I'm just reviewing the song itself, not the written content.

Negatives:
1. Not only has Jon been lowering the keys, singing in one note, he's now basically talking the verses and even semi talking the chorus... But the Stones made a career out of it so why not?

2. His speech... The way he pronounces certain words like "Badge". He's also slurry / spitting words. He really needs a new vocal coach to reset him.

3. No Real Melody, No Hooks, Nothing to grab you.

4. The songs been done already. As I stated a few times now, it's a Bruce song from 20 years ago.

Positive:
1. The Production: Considering it was done virtually, the sound came out pretty good. It's not just killed with Shanks overproduction.

2. It's better than Do What You Can - which might be the single worst song Jon has ever done. Joey and Working Man are masterpieces compared to that one.

Neutral:
1. It's 2013 again when Jon put those two Stand Up Guy songs on What About Now as bonus tracks... I feel like we're back to that again... Same feel...Some fans embraced it, some hated it, and others were neutral.

2. The Lyrics. I was a day behind everyone (or at least a few hours) and based on everyone's reviews, I was expected to be blow away. I've always said that Jon's strength to this very day are his lyrics so they are not bad by any means but they aren't off the charts either. "The Spirits, The Intoxicate Me, I Watch Them Infiltrate My Soul" are bad ass lyrics.



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I wonder if it's delivery or just the amount of compression and effects to keep his voice sounding good. His live voice feels much thinner and more brittle, these songs after all the editing come out sounding too thick if that makes sense?

RonJovi 07-11-2020 12:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Captain_jovi (Post 1265384)
Fair enough, I see where you're coming from. For what it's worth, I was under the under the impression he's using "I can't breathe" in this instance due to George Floyd's last words etc. I think taking issue with X on fire twice is a bit of a stretch but I get it.

It is for sure hollow in points but I fall into the camp where I'd rather something specific than universal. I genuinely can't take another empty, universal song. He can write those in his sleep at this point. Get off your knees, sparks and fires, blind men can see, raise your hand. Sincerely, I'm done with it. It doesn't make this song better but it makes it hit harder.

There was “fire in the sky” for We Dont Run and he was “torching the skyline” during “When we were us” too. He uses the fire metaphor a fair bit and I think he could have done better here.

I don’t want a universal song in the vein of Everyday, WWBTF, Live Before You Die or any of that shite. They’re just empty cliches.

But if I look at songs like Always, SIBSN, IHLYG, Lie To Me, WLOL, MAM, LWTG they all spoke to me because they went beyond empty simplistic cliches and tapped into real experiences. Jon has a talent for taking how he feels and turning it into what everyone else feels too. All those IML clones were just simplistic nonsense with a very childish message. In my view, those songs are much worse than American Reckoning.

faith1985 07-11-2020 12:08 AM

The I'cant Breath has probably been used before because it fitted the situation, but this time it is one of the 'main things' about the situation because it literally led to George's death

I am trying not to grade songs anymore. I try to listen more with my heart. Especially with this very topic! He sings what he feels and it touches me. The line about the kid brought me to tears. The harmonica stands out and it is very special to me. For me, this is why I started loving this band, apart from the drive in the rock songs.

faith1985 07-11-2020 12:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RonJovi (Post 1265386)
There was “fire in the sky” for We Dont Run and he was “torching the skyline” during “When we were us” too. He uses the fire metaphor a fair bit and I think he could have done better here.

I don’t want a universal song in the vein of Everyday, WWBTF, Live Before You Die or any of that shite. They’re just empty cliches.

But if I look at songs like Always, SIBSN, IHLYG, Lie To Me, WLOL, MAM, LWTG they all spoke to me because they went beyond empty simplistic cliches and tapped into real experiences. Jon has a talent for taking how he feels and turning it into what everyone else feels too. All those IML clones were just simplistic nonsense with a very childish message. In my view, those songs are much worse than American Reckoning.


I get what you say about the clones but there are lines in this that are far from being lazy and empty. The opposite. At least for me! And BTW:I think 'shining a light' is a beautiful metaphor.

RonJovi 07-11-2020 12:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by faith1985 (Post 1265388)
I get what you say about the clones but there are lines in this that are far from being lazy and empty. The opposite. At least for me! And BTW:I think 'shining a light' is a beautiful metaphor.

Shine a Light actually doesn’t bother me from this. I think it fits quite well. It’s just the first verse I’ve a problem with. The rest is lyrically pretty good.

Alphavictim 07-11-2020 12:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RonJovi (Post 1265381)
True but that’s not really my point. The big hits, “Prayer”, “Bad Name”, “IBTFY”, “Bed of Roses”, “In These Arms”, TAALS”, “IML” we’re all songs that people could personally relate to and apply to their lives.

Bed of Roses?! The "some blonde gave me nightmares, I think she's still in my bed" line is a tad too rock starish for me to relate to (whether you apply it to a hungry groupie or a blonde guitar).

bonjovi90 07-11-2020 01:22 AM

This song kind of leaves me with a bittersweet taste. Simply because I've come to realize that our verdict, "decent lyrics for the last years and it serves its purpose quite well" is probably the best we're ever gonna get from now on.
Jon's vocal limitations and the fact that he criminally underuses his band have pressed it all into a mould that I don't think will work in the long run.

Kathleen 07-11-2020 01:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adam D (Post 1265371)
Jon, as a white man, is commenting on the fact that he will never have to have the talk with his kids in the same way that black parents have to have with theirs.

Black parents have to look at the police differently than almost any other race in the US. I can't imagine what it must be like to have to train your kids, basically from birth, to be wary of the police and law enforcement.

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Maybe it's just me - but I am as white as you can be and I have been hassled by the cops since I was 16. Even my car was suspect. I was a "hippie" then and fair game for the cops. Once I had kids, it turned out that any teenage boy was fairgame for the cops. (I had 2 boys first) My eldest son had a gun drawn on him in front of his own home in Ridgewood, NJ because somebody called the cops and said he was making them uncomfortable. UNCOMFORTABLE? Both Paul and I were at the police station the next morning and filing a complaint. So yes - I had the same talk with my kids as any good black parent would. Don't beak the law and avoid the cops at all costs. To this day I won't support the cops.

Captain_jovi 07-11-2020 03:34 AM

It's been 15 years of bigger-than-life-optimism-everyone-can-relate-to. How can anyone bitch that he finally writes a song about a subject matter directly if that's the big issue. *shrugs* He's never going to do a song most of us love but he actually wrote a non moon/June/spoon song about something. Maybe my standards have been horribly lowered but this is steps in the right direction.

Supersonic 07-11-2020 09:36 AM

Aloha !

Quote:

Originally Posted by Captain_jovi (Post 1265397)
Maybe my standards have been horribly lowered but this is steps in the right direction.

Yes, your standards have been horribly lowered. You're making up excuses as to why you think you should like it. That step in the right direction is mentioned every time Jon changes something up that's supposedly better.

The heavy guitars on Bounce were a step in the right direction. And no weak ballads on Have A Nice Day were a step in the direction. And the production on Lost Highway was a step in the right direction. And the absence of country songs on The Circle were a step in the right direction. The production on What About Now were a step in the right direction.

Jon's taken so many steps in the right direction he ought to be there by now but for every step in the right direction he still takes two backwards.

Salaam Aleikum,
Sebastiaan


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