Both sides of the camp changed their answers to fit the agenda they wanted to push. "Wanted to spend time with my daughter" slowly morphed into "Jon and I weren't seeing eye to eye" him Richie being disgruntled about the last decade or so. He's not unwarranted in feeling that way, I would too, but unfortunately no one is sticking to the same story.

Jon also gave an interview where he implied something like: my daughter is stupid. three more to go. I stll think that Jon is a narcissist who only deeply cares about his needs.
On a side note : seeing the cover band tour they just did, it is clear that Sambora is not replaceable, at least for me.

I am sure it is a combination of many things but it had been clear for some time that something was not right. I hate to constantely mention it but if you look at the WWWB doc and see Jon standing there wanting to come off as a business, man I knew he lost it quite a bit. There is this one scene where Richie and Jon come backstage right after the show and they seem like total strangers to each other.

And the fact that Jon is constantely bragging about everything is a sign that he has a big ego problem AND needs to feel important. And if this does not change, the music will never get better again IMO. Psychologically speaking: the more someone feels the need to be important the more insecurities he has

If you are a legend, you don't feel the need to be important. People with a heathy self-esteem are usually quite humbled. But Jon himself said he has a chip on his shoulder, so here we go.

Thank you Faith, exactly my sentiments too.

Still not sure how all that = he doesn't care about his daughter. But ok.

His daughter is stupid for OD'ing, he's not wrong. He was bound to be pissed, he doesn't like negative press, but that doesn't mean he doesn't care.

It is probably fair to question when the personal relationships in Bon Jovi morphed almost exclusively into professional ones. Jon seems to have increasingly become "the boss" over the last 20 years.

However, is that journey enough (I mean, it's all we are privy to) to suggest he is of poor enough character to essentially say he doesn't care about his kids? That's some psychology of the worst kind, i.e. completely baseless.

I never said he doesn't care about his family. It's just the way he handles it, it's the way he lives. He said once that Dot basically raised their kids because he was constantly on the road. He would play the gigs and have the plane ready in case he got a phone call that Dot was in labour. I don't doubt he was shaken with the news with Stephanie's overdosing but then, knowing him, I wouldn't expect him to stay home longer than necessary. He's just like that. Can't say it's good or bad; there are people who wouldn't leave home for longer than 24 h and there are people who are home once in a while. If it works for you, OK. I just don't think that Stephanie's overdosing contributed as factor number one to his depression that he admitted he'd suffered in the last few years *because* it was less than a month he was back on stage and then on a year-long tour. I do think when Steph was back at home, she was doing fine and had proper care, he knew he left her in good hands. And he left again.

Well, but he was never the same when he entered the WAN tour, both in terms of performance and vocals to what he had been before hand. Even the 12 12 12 concert, he looked like a different person.

Yeah, but in terms of this scenarion, Richie is just the same. Especially in his latter years with Bon Jovi, he was constantly bragging and exaggerating numbers in interviews, too.

Richie pre and post HAND tour feel like two different people from all the shit he went through, yeah. After that it started feeling very "put on" in interviews sometimes.

The first reason Richie gave had **** all to do with Ava; but people keep ignoring that. Ava wasn't given as a "reason" until November 2013. The very first thing Richie said, other than it was a private matter, was "Jon and I just aren't happening right now" and when pressed to say, specifically, what the obstacles were, he said, "the band is like a 2nd family and family business stays in the family" which indicated pretty clearly that 1) something was going on between him and Jon, and 2) it was related to the band.

Jon saying Richie "had issues with stuff" supports Richie's first statement way more than it does addictions being the problem. And "he just wouldn't show up anymore" is a far cry from just deciding not to show up that night in Calgary, which is what Jon has implied up to this point. Given that Jon seemed to be the one phoning it in during the first leg, when was it that Richie allegedly "just wouldn't show up anymore"?

Richie's "changes" may have elaborated or expanded on his reasons, but there was no contradiction. He specified creative differences and going in different directions, which could've been part of why he and Jon weren't "happening". He later added Ava as a reason, which could have been another reason, without denying previously mentioned band issues. I still think it was a smokescreen to avoid discussing band issues; but that's beside the point. It didn't contradict anything else he said.

Jon's "changes" repeatedly contradicted other things he said. Contradicted, as in both things can't be true. It was alcohol/it wasn't alcohol; there was no reason/it was his habits, demons or issues; there was no fight/"or you say I hate my brother and I'm leaving the band"; we haven't spoken/we talked some; I got a call at 3:30 in the afternoon/we didn't expect Richie to quit in the middle of the night.... At one point, Jon confirmed Richie's claim that leaving the band had nothing to do with drugs and alcohol. Then, for whatever reason, he decided to start implying that again in 2016.

Say what you want to about both sides changing their stories; but only one side has directly contradicted other things he said.



And before somebody starts bitching about why the hell we're still discussing this, page Jon. He's the one who can't seem to let it go or keep his mouth shut about it.