Jovitalk - Bon Jovi Fan Community

Jovitalk - Bon Jovi Fan Community (https://drycounty.com/jovitalk/index.php)
-   Tour Discussion (https://drycounty.com/jovitalk/forumdisplay.php?f=8)
-   -   Richie Sambora, does he save the live show? (https://drycounty.com/jovitalk/showthread.php?t=70575)

Thinny 06-13-2019 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by efpg0708 (Post 1254769)
A lot of people talk as if Richie was on top of his game when he left. Let’s not forget he was far from it, even though he was OK by his 2013 standards.

As for guitar playing, of course his style is the right one for Bon Jovi, but he had become a very sloppy guitar player by then. I’d say the last time Richie stole the show with his playing was on Any Other Day in 2007 at the O2 Arena.

Watch some of the footage from the tour right before Richie left, he was on fire for most of those shows...

Quote:

Originally Posted by efpg0708 (Post 1254769)
I don’t think he would save the show, because since 2006 his voice went downhill as well, and he was no longer the “leading backing voice” anymore. That was Bobby. So it wouldn’t make much difference today when it comes to backing up Jon’s vocals.

Richie's voice was still all over those shows. Yes Bobby was doing more, but Richie's vocals were still at the forefront of the backing vocals without a doubt. You can't help but miss that in the current line up.

bonjovi90 06-13-2019 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavetheGodofKeys (Post 1254779)
Really? I remember reading in another thread a few years ago ,that he was with the band in Calgary, and then the obvious part that he never showed up.

He called Jon the day before the show, asking if it was okay for him to come at the day of the concert. The following day, he called the tour manager, telling him he wasn't going to come.

Gesendet von meinem Nexus 5X mit Tapatalk

JackieBlue 06-13-2019 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BJFan99 (Post 1254780)
I don't think Richie's return would make much, if any, difference on Jon's vocals in general. Actually, I don't think his absence has made Jon's voice decline anymore since 2013 - he was getting somewhat better around mid-to-late 2014 (as was showcased by the Red Bank benefit show in July, for example; his tone was much better and more pleasant there than in late '13)... kudos to you :)

Thanks, and you could be right. As I said, if it's purely physical, Richie wouldn't help a bit (except for coverage or distraction); and I have no problem with you disagreeing about the possible psych effect Richie had on Jon's singing. It's not my theory, anyway. :)
Jon's the one who said repeatedly, in 2016, that Richie's departure was so devastating he couldn't sing in the shower or write songs during all of 2014. But as you pointed out, Jon did several shows in 2014 without noticeable difficulty. In a 2014 interview, he also said he'd written a dozen songs for a new album, his heart was broken over the NFL deal and betrayal by the record company, and losing Richie was no big deal because being in a rock band's not a life sentence.

That's why I prefaced all of it with "If it's true...". I've learned to add that caveat to anything that's based on Jon's comments. With the way he contradicts himself to suit his current story, it's hard to know what the truth really is. :)

Tictoc 06-13-2019 02:47 PM

Richie was the Bon Jovi sound. Lets not fool ourselves here. Jon was the commercial showman who sold the records but Richie was the soul that kept people coming back.

Tico and David are replaceable but Richie is not. I don't know much about guitar work but hearing Phil and his terrible tone and workman like guitar playing makes me realise how great Richie was.

Removing Richie from the equation is like taking tomato sauce out of a bolognese and still calling it bolognese.

So yeah, he'd save it.

Captain_jovi 06-13-2019 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JackieBlue (Post 1254770)
Yes, we've had this discussion before; and I'm sorry, Captain, but that dog still don't hunt. If it had been the first time they tried something like that, and then stopped it when he saw the result, I might buy it. But I'm pretty sure that Jon was at the same shows you were, plus a few; so he would have been fully aware of when people took beer/bathroom breaks, and that they were going to be singing a lot of songs from an unreleased album, before he told Richie he could sing songs from AOTL and continue promoting his album on the BWC tour. Not to mention the fact, also previously discussed, that lulls in the show or people taking breaks has never stopped Jon from doing any song that he wanted to do.

Jon doing a song he wants to do that tanks creates a lull, Jon leaving the stage creates people flat out leaving for a bit. While both are bad, one is worse. I'm obviously not saying that 100 percent played into the decision.

My brain is foggy sometimes, do we have some interview with Jon saying Richie was going to sing his new songs on the tour? I know there was the one that Richie gave. It feels like we're treating this like they had an agreement where they'd tour earlier than expected in exchange for him promoting his album on tour and I don't know where it's coming from.

JackieBlue 06-13-2019 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tictoc (Post 1254823)
Richie was the Bon Jovi sound. Lets not fool ourselves here. Jon was the commercial showman who sold the records but Richie was the soul that kept people coming back.

Tico and David are replaceable but Richie is not. I don't know much about guitar work but hearing Phil and his terrible tone and workman like guitar playing makes me realise how great Richie was.

Removing Richie from the equation is like taking tomato sauce out of a bolognese and still calling it bolognese.

So yeah, he'd save it.

IMO, each of the original members, including Hugh and Alec, contributed something unique that defined the Bon Jovi sound in the beginning. So I can't agree that Tico and Dave are replaceable. Otherwise, I agree with every word.

I don't know guitars either, but I know voices; and both Jon's and Richie's are so distinctive that either of them would be hard to emulate, much less duplicate or replace. Replacing the blend of the two is virtually impossible. I even heard Jon say something like that in an old interview I watched not too long ago. When he was talking about the formation of the band, he said something like the way his voice and Richie's blended was magic; and that was what defined Bon Jovi's sound. I can't quote him exactly from memory; but that's close. It caught my attention because I see the word "magic" used a lot when people talk about what's missing from the band these days; but I was a little surprised to hear it from Jon, years before Richie left.

Captain_jovi 06-13-2019 05:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JackieBlue (Post 1254833)
IMO, each of the original members, including Hugh and Alec, contributed something unique that defined the Bon Jovi sound in the beginning. So I can't agree that Tico and Dave are replaceable. Otherwise, I agree with every word.

I don't know guitars either, but I know voices; and both Jon's and Richie's are so distinctive that either of them would be hard to emulate, much less duplicate or replace. Replacing the blend of the two is virtually impossible. I even heard Jon say something like that in an old interview I watched not too long ago. When he was talking about the formation of the band, he said something like the way his voice and Richie's blended was magic; and that was what defined Bon Jovi's sound. I can't quote him exactly from memory; but that's close. It caught my attention because I see the word "magic" used a lot when people talk about what's missing from the band these days; but I was a little surprised to hear it from Jon, years before Richie left.

This is dead on. I want to find the Jon interview from 2001/2002 when recording Bounce demos they tried using a session drummer because Tico wasn't available and they eventually trashed it because it just didn't sound like them. Times have changed and it's kind of sad.

efpg0708 06-13-2019 07:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thinny (Post 1254781)
Watch some of the footage from the tour right before Richie left, he was on fire for most of those shows...



Richie's voice was still all over those shows. Yes Bobby was doing more, but Richie's vocals were still at the forefront of the backing vocals without a doubt. You can't help but miss that in the current line up.

Yes, he was energetic , but that doesnÂ’t mean his playing was great. DonÂ’t get me wrong, IÂ’m not saying he was butchering the songs. Of course his guitar sound is the right one for Bon Jovi, because he created it, so if he was to come back, I reckon the bandÂ’s sound would gain from it. But I donÂ’t think that would make the shows great again, because as I said, he has been very sloppy for the last decade or so. By sloppy, I mean he wasnÂ’t adding anything new by playing the same licks over and over again, and even making a lot of mistakes. Take a look at his Any Other day outro solo from Lisbon 2011 and compare it with the O2 2007 one. In 2011, he was given the spotlight to improvise and let loose, but he couldnÂ’t, going back to the same lick and ending his solo. As for the vocals, of course his vocals were a big part of the bandÂ’s sound, but in 2013 his vocals were being drowned more and more into the mix, and Bobby was the one backing up Jon most of the time.

Thinny 06-13-2019 08:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by efpg0708 (Post 1254840)
Yes, he was energetic , but that doesnÂ’t mean his playing was great. DonÂ’t get me wrong, IÂ’m not saying he was butchering the songs. Of course his guitar sound is the right one for Bon Jovi, because he created it, so if he was to come back, I reckon the bandÂ’s sound would gain from it. But I donÂ’t think that would make the shows great again, because as I said, he has been very sloppy for the last decade or so. By sloppy, I mean he wasnÂ’t adding anything new by playing the same licks over and over again, and even making a lot of mistakes. Take a look at his Any Other day outro solo from Lisbon 2011 and compare it with the O2 2007 one. In 2011, he was given the spotlight to improvise and let loose, but he couldnÂ’t, going back to the same lick and ending his solo. As for the vocals, of course his vocals were a big part of the bandÂ’s sound, but in 2013 his vocals were being drowned more and more into the mix, and Bobby was the one backing up Jon most of the time.

His playing was great on those shows, lots of people were commenting about how on form he was and his vocals were still very prominent. Bobby had started to do some of the higher stuff but Richie's voice was still at the forefront of the mix. The absence of his voice is very noticable now.

DestinationJovi 06-13-2019 08:58 PM

I don't know what it really means to "save" the live show but Richie was the lead guitarist and background vocalist in this band for 30 years. OF COURSE the live show would vastly improve with him playing and singing instead of these newbies trying to duplicate his guitar parts and sound. I mean, isn't that a given?


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 03:13 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11.
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.