Riots in France (now germany?)
 

heard something on the news earlier that people were kicking off in germany now , but i cant find anything on bbc (net)

what do you think about this. im not sure i get quite why they are doing it?
is it because they have been treated like crap by the government and they cant get jobs or what? (is it racism) there must be some serious frustration for people to start doing this all over france.
what do you reckon ?

I guess that the french has always been closed to the "edge"...

the mercantili…(aah I don’t know the word in English!) wave during the 1870' was a French idea. Then they got pissed of due to the fact that the price on products they produced fell...

It's a very complex situation and a result of incompetent politics for the past 30 years.

It's not "all over" France yet, just in some suburbs of some of the main cities. You can still hang around safely in most suburbs and city centers. It could however spread rapidly and even more dramatically.

The concerned suburbs were built in the 1960 to welcome most of the immigrating population from North Africa. To this day, this population still represents the majority of the people living there. The configuration of these suburbs has also maintained a certain communitarism. There are also real problems such as racial discrimination in France, especially regarding employment and housing, that have kept a lot (too many) of these people in these suburbs. All this slowing a necessary integration.

The first generation kept silent of all this, too happy to live in appartments with water and electricity, and keen on integrating themselves through their jobs. The second generation, as French citizens, received the minimum education and information to realise the injustices. Some still managed to get out of these ghettos by working twice as hard... Others sucked it in and let it all out through violence against anything that represents the State or wears a uniform, from Policemen to Fire Fighters or even Mailmen. My cousin worked in these suburbs as a fire fighter. He once had to bring a guy that had been stabbed back to life with the stabber holding a gun on his head telling him that if the guy died he would hold him responsible. His truck was thrown stones at when coming in to fight a fire and actually save people... That's how full of nonesense the situation is, that's how deep the crisis gets.

In the meantime all governments failed to realise what was a slowly but surely rottening situation. Through inappropriate coward reforms they just slowed the process at best.

The groups that are rioting these days do not represent the majority of their neighbourhoods. A lot of people in there just want to go on with their lives, but these bastards just want to set things on fire for the sake of pissing the State off. The people in these suburbs have been crying for help, schools, sports arenas, associations and all to get them a life. That's what the bastards are burning today. It just makes no sense. These are a stupid hopeless minority, but the danger now is that integrists, mainly islamists, are behind them as they are also well hidden in these suburbs.It's a safe bet to say they're starting to organise the whole mess.

In reaction, the government is showing all it's incompetence and deconnection from the real world, all the political correctness that makes it so numb.

What France needs now is nothing else than redefine it's institutions, it's education, it's social, immigration and employment plans, etc... Anything else, though probably calming things down for a while, would just delay an even bigger mess.


Ponrauil

From what I've heard, this is mainly a problem of immigrants (primarily of the muslim religion) rioting, culture clash and all that. This is what happens when you let "just anybody" in. The answer is not to bribe these...terrorists...(yikes, I hate saying that, but that's what they are) with financial programs, the answer is to fight them till they stop.

During (I think) the Rodney King riots, the mayor of Chicago issued this order to police for the duration of the emergency: Shoot to kill arsonists, shoot to maim looters. The rioting ended. Cut, paste.

Adrian

what a mess i wonder if this kind off stuff might spread? i doubt it will in england very easily because i think it is a very intergrated society (in general) but i dont know about other places in europe. it seems from what i can make out that they are very organised. i dont think it will be easy to stop this. i dont really think the french government will really want to start shooting people dead in the streets. how awfull.

No. That's what happens when you have no integration plan, nothing for the immigrants to hope for once they're there, who ever you let in.

And these people weren't "let in" in the first place. These are second or third generations people. They were born in France. They're as French as I am. As for the first generation, France needed them to do the dirty work and made them come.

These people are in a disastrous situation because of present and past French governments as much as because of themselves.
The Government killing them for something it's partly responsible for wouldn't solve anything.

This isn't the US.


Ponrauil

I don't know either.
If communication between let down people and the government has been cut for decades, as it's been in France, in some parts of other countries it just might.


Ponrauil

its not about letting "just anybody" in . i think the problem comes when different cultures arent intergrated into the community.
although saying that all the london bombers were born in this country.
its not as easy as just shoot people dead in the streets i dont think the french government really wanna get banned from the UN.?

Ponrauil,jbjhand:I said it was also a culture clash thing. These terrorists can't just be allowed to carve out their own little quasi-nation just because they refuse to integrate.

And the rioting is the fault of the rioters. It's not the governments fault until the government starts pulling up paving stones and handing them molotovs. Multiply every terrorist by 5.56NATO and the problem stops, probably with very few deaths, because the remaining scum usually don't want to die. If the UN doesn't want to let people and governments defend themselves from what's coming close to civil war, screw them.

Adrian

It's not a cultural, it's a social.


No, they are not allowed to use violence and create a zone with their own rules. That's why the police are in there.
They're allowed to be angry though.


Partly, not only. What if some of their reasons are justified? Should they still be killed?

It's ALSO the Government's fault when the fundamentals of "Freedom, Equality and Fraternity" (France's slogan) are not applicable everywhere, and where their disrespect (by employers, police or anyone else) is not punished as it should.


You mean like with terrorists in Iraq? How efficient.

Kill one rioter in there and all similar suburbs in France explode.


The UN has nothing to do with this.


Ponrauil