Anti-war crap - My last say on the topic
 

This week we ask Britons from a variety of walks of life for their view on war with Iraq. First up is ex-soldier John Berry, 54, of Edinburgh, who plans to march for peace this Saturday.

I'm no pacifist but I firmly believe that a war has to have a just cause.

John Berry served in the army for 14 years
The last Gulf War was a bit of a sham, as this one will be. Yes, Iraq did invade Kuwait in 1991, but America's reasons for throwing them out were questionable - so too are the reasons this time.

I hope to make it to Glasgow this coming weekend for the rally. But I really do despair, for no matter what, we all know the likely outcome.

I know in my heart that this rally will not make a jot of difference to the decision-makers. But come the next general election, when we next get a chance to make our voices heard, Tony Blair will be out on his ear.

Even as an ex-soldier, I find it incredible that we can commit so many servicemen and women to a conflict without the say so of an elected parliament.

I've no doubt that Iraq deserves a better person at the helm, but like it or not, it's a country in its own right. Toppling Saddam Hussein must be done democratically - it is up to the Iraqi people to decide who their leader should be, once Saddam's grip on the helm has been loosened.

That's not to say that the international community does not have a part to play.

Amnesty International is doing a marvellous job, and these are the people who should be to the fore. And I applaud France and Germany for refusing to toe the US line and instead pushing for inspections, not war.

I really do believe that the greatest threat to the UK still comes from dissident IRA groups rather than Islamic militants. A war with Iraq will surely change that - I fear it will unleash a dreadful storm.

God help and forgive us all, but most of all, help the poor children of Iraq.

This is pretty much my stance, & I have been pretty vocal but this is the last I will post here on the subject.


At the bottom of the article is a link with a good representation of the UK opinion.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/2748395.stm

Mike

Re: Anti-war crap - My last say on the topic
 

Yes, but you have to wonder how democratic an election that gives a 100% victory to Saddam! I would argue that they don't have a "proper" decmocracy...

However, this isn't to say I support the war, I don't. I agree with a lot that you say. I think it's inevitably going to happen. They could have had this war at any time in the last 10 years, I think they're doing it right because the climit with this 'war on terrorism' means they'll have some public support..... I think the question on oil is one which has to be looked at, because I think the morrality of a war is possiably being used to cover up the fact that the heart of the war is going to be fought over oil....

Yes sure, vote Tony out, but who you going to vote for... Ian Dunken Smith????? Charles Kenedy (I was laughed at when I said this.... third party = wasted vote)

Re: Anti-war crap - My last say on the topic
 

True - No opposition.

The point about voting Saddam out though.... There r numerous groups looking to do this from the inside & this has been successful in many occasions - one very recently mentioned by someone at the bottom of the article.

you can't just democrize (right word?) a country like the iraq. people wouldn't know how to do it, they would only ever accept a single leader, never a party system like ours. it's in their religion and whole way of life

choclady is right... look at Afghanistan - or has everyone forgotten about that since the war now has a new battelground??!! It's been virtually left now...

Rubbish... in America maybe..

in the UK this is the worst time to start it - the political climate is messed up... splits in labour and conservative parties...

backbenchers... MPs after 1990-91 resigned in mass numbers... same will happen...

the people don't support it... numerous polls, protests, biggest ever in UK today for example.

except the turn out was much lower than they expected.

Do you think this was would be going ahead if America didn't want it? If it's right for America, then it's up to everybody else to make it right for themselves. I doubt very much that if the US weren't involved, then the morral obligation to go to war would most certainly be overlooked by Blair!

To be honest, I don't see how a party could be united over something as controversial as this. You're always going to have MP's standing against the party line on something as important as this, so it's always going to cause splits, people are always going to resign over these sorts of issues. The fact is, I think Labour probably feel faily confident in going against public opinion because the opposition is so divided, and weak. If there was a strong opposition, then going to war at this time could have huge consequences for Labour, however now unless the war itself is a big failure, then I doubt people would vote in the conservative shambles.

choclady, you live in Germany, who untill prior to 1918 only ever had a autocratic leader. People didn't nessesarily want democracy, didn't trust it, and it failed. But ultimately, it was able to succeed, was this just by chance? You could have said 100 years ago that Germany will only ever accept one leader.

maybe i didnt make my point clear enough. what i meant was that due to their fundamental religious beliefs a democracy as we know it is highly unlikely.

I actually agree with this if - god forbid - it is just about the oil. Riding the crest of 9/11 means attacks such as this will get more support (look at afghanistan - lots of support there). But it has been a step too far & has backfired somewhat.

Mike

Maybe it has, but then I'm against the war, but their is part of me that feels this has to happen.

Let me explain. 9/11 made I think people feel vunerable, at least that's how I felt. If I'm reading propaganda that this vunrability is going to be taken advantage of by Iraq, that they can, and would cause devistation to my world as with 9/11, then there is going to be part of me that will feel safer is something is done. Looking at things logically, you can look at the oil issue, the fact that Iraq are not the only country that poses this very same threat, and asses that war is a bad thing. Yet, we're told that there are links with terrorism, that Saddam could inflict the same devestation as with 9/11, and as a result, there is a definate feeling that we are vunerable, and we need to defend ourselves. I don't buy all the propaganda, and like I said I'm against the imidiate war, but then again, there is part of me that feels threatened, and by squashing Saddam, I would feel partly safer. I think this is where the support will come from, and I think it's the reason why if a war is succesful, people will soon forget the fact that the war was wrong, because they will feel safer.

Maybe, but how can you know this? Surely any change is going to be doubtful of success. I certainy get your point, but then people always fear change, and just because people are used to one thing, doesn't mean that another way isn't going to work. Also, as I understood it, the intension of war isn't nessesarily to turn Iraq into a democratic system of government, but to replace Saddam with a regime chosen by America.... i.e a regime that will do what Bush says on harboring terrorists, oil, e.t.c