Funny to compare the alternative/demo version to the final one, as exactly the guitar part I like the most about the song (the "stop" in the bridge, just before "Why does someone always have to doubt it") isn't in the demo and was probably played by Phil. And I thought at the time that Richie finally played stuff like that too. How ironic ;-)

You're not missing anything.

Richie also got hooked on pills after he broke his shoulder during the HAND tour.

I assume the album with the 2 new songs is still being released on Friday? I've not seen any promotion for it...

Have you got proof?

Richie himself had stated so around the LH era. Plus you just need to look at how immensely he was bloated up in 2006 as the tour progressed.

True. Richie looked very bloated up in 2006 but I've always thought it was because of alcohol and not pills?

Richie has had issues with alcohol since probably the NJ era. Sometimes more, sometimes less. But he had never looked as bad as during the 2006 tour. Right before the Japanese leg in January he had broken his shoulder and took a lot of painkillers to make it through the shows. He later on admitted that he couldn't get off the combination of booze and painkillers as the tour went on and became addicted to that.

In 2012, this was even reflected in You Can Only Get So High:
Down seven tylenols for breakfast
Chased it down with last night"s cloudy memory
Empty bottle preach the gospel
Another shot ain't coming close to saving me
Close to saving me

Proof? Lmao. Google it man.

Richie has talked about it many times. It's not a secret. It's common knowledge.

Like I've stated before... Richie has a bigger alcohol and drug problem then most think... He just hides it / downplays it very well...

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unfortunately i think its true and explains a lot/

I don't think he hides it well at all... There are interviews and solo gigs where he is clearly off and is acting strange...

I don't think he tries to hide it at all. He's talked openly about it for as long as I've been following the band.

Recently, over the last couple of years especially, there have been a lot of erratic performances and interviews; and it could very well be because Richie's in over his head with substance abuse again. Because of his history that's everybody's first guess, just like people first assumed he was in rehab when he didn't show up in Calgary. But just like then, there could also be some things going on that we're not aware of, other than, or in addition to, his addictions.

I was wondering when someone is going to come up with a direct-to-TV movie based on real life events and spiced up using some extra!dramatic!theories courtesy of this board. Jon & Richie: A True Story (alternative working title: Their Truth)

I'd watch, but only if they make Dave a diva who freaks out every time someone touches his precious conditioner bottles.

Soooo, any updates on Walls? Didn't they have a TV performance on the 22nd?

Never happen... at least while Jon is still alive

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When is this album coming out? I have 8 copies coming to me from ticket sales...

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Isn't it Feb 23rd? That's when I thought the first song was to be released originally, along with the re-release.

They do, but I think it was already pre-taped and When We Were Us was played.

If he hid it well, we wouldn't be talking about it almost everyday ever since he left the band.

Hell, I was better at hiding my drinking from parents 8 years ago than Richie was in 2013-2015.

If we're talking "noticeable" as far as drinking goes I will never forget him slurring "Words can't say what love me do" in Montreal summer of 2006. But that could have also been a mix of the painkillers too.

But like everyone is saying if he's been drinking since the 80's something would have changed, he was competent and pretty eloquent in interviews until the last decade or so. I just don't think it's booze and booze alone.

Didn't Steven Tyler fall off the wagon when he was on painkilling medication a couple years back, too? Hell, Tom Petty DIED from a painkiller overdose. It's not like that stuff is easy to shake or harmless. (Plus, coupled with booze, side effects ensue)

True enough!

To get back on topic, according to ASCAP Jon and Shanks wrote both of the two new songs.

Yes, but that happened in 2009, not a couple years back.

He's been going strong ever since.

The effects of poor habits are cumulative (drinking, abuse of illegal or legal drugs, smoking, eating unhealthy foods, sun exposure, bad posture... whatever it is, the longer you do it, the more side effects you see).

Nah. That was just his Dean Martin persona colliding with his Beatles influences. :D


Well, that could be explained by the snowball effect that addictions can have over the years, where things get steadily worse. But that’s another easy jump to make. I agree that if the explanation was that simple, we would probably have seen a more consistent downward spiral since 2005-ish; and that hasn’t been the case. He was obviously struggling during HAND and LH; then seemed ok for a while; but suddenly went into rehab in April 2011. Then from the time he returned in June, he seemed back on his game for the rest of the GH tour and while he was writing and recording AOTL, including those performances. Even throughout the first leg of the BWC tour he seemed fine and, according to some people, actually carried those shows. Unless you consider the occasional “lip-licking” that some people assumed was coke-related, there was no real appearance of substance abuse through the rest of 2013 and most of 2014, iirc. Then his performances and behavior in interviews became more erratic again during late 2016 and 2017.

So, instead of a steady decline, there’s been an up/down or on/off pattern. The timing of the “off” behaviors seems to parallel major upheavals in his personal and professional lives, which leads me to believe there are mitigating circumstances, or it's something else that we don't know about. People have suggested things like illness, anti-depressants, or a lack of confidence coupled with over-compensation.

That’s not to say that his addictions haven’t played a part, especially with the painkiller component. Richie wrote, “…you cure your problems with a bottle of instant forget” but I know too many people who started out taking painkillers for physical pain, then found that it helped them “forget” a lot of emotional pain as well. Maybe the “personal demons” that Jon and David keep referring to aren’t Richie’s addictions, per se, but whatever it is that he may be trying to bury under them.

Strange, that.

I was confused enough about why, after people had waited so long for RSO’s new music, all they wanted to talk about on the “Richie (new music)” thread seemed to be Richie’s shortcomings. But it’s REALLY confusing to see that that’s taken over the BJ “new music” thread, too. And even more confusing is that most of the time it’s not the Richie apologists who bring him up. I don't know if it's Richie’s flaws or Jon’s voice that gets the most discussion. One thing for dead sure, it’s clearly not the band or the music. Richie may not be an official band member any longer, but it’s hard to deny that we're still living with a ghost. ;)


Anyway... to follow you back on topic: it’s not surprising that Jon and Shanks wrote both of the two new songs, since they’ve been joined at the hip for the last decade or so. But if poor David couldn’t get a word in edgewise with Jon and "Mookie" in the studio, as Jon said, what’s surprising to me is that he can manage it now, with the Jon and “Snooky” show.

Given that Billy Falcon has co-written quite a bit of music lately, I don't see why any new track should be assumed to be a JBJ/JS composition by default.

Yeah, it's an over-glorification to say it's always always always Shanks as the co-writer. It's been Shanks, Falcon and a handful of one off writers dating back to Lost Highway, as well as writing alone, Jon has been using.

Tomorrow show?
https://dfa7z742m6igx.cloudfront.net...g?v=1518711583

I agree 100% and I wouldn't assume, by default, that the new songs were. But considering the number of songs Jon and Shanks have co-written, and the IGs from Shanks or Phil-X in the studio, and Jon's comments from last year about how closely he and Shanks have worked together over the last decade, I can't believe that anyone would be surprised by it, either.

video on instagram about the official video coming on friday

On Tidal from Friday

Okay so When we were us is gonna be on tidal on Friday... Which means like another 2 weeks for Spotify users... Ugh


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And to think I almost canceled my Tidal subscription lol!

You and millions of others

The song has been on YouTube for over month and nobody bothered to delete it.

What a fantastically executed release strategy, well done Island Records! What a great decision made by the BJ camp to stay there!

I'm 99 percent sure Island isn't in charge. If what I remember is correct Island is in for distribution and everything else is based on who management hires. Either way this is a huge bungle and not capitalizing on the press they got from the rock hall is foolish.

What’s more important is if it goes to radio and gets picked up. I’m hoping it will be among the songs they promote on Volume Friday during Feedback or Debatable.

Based on that 15 second snippet, it sounded exactly the same as it did on Howard... So for those who thought that the Howard version was some unfinished version purposely played to trick fans or something, you are completely wrong.

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