[cgurtner]

Hey, thank you so much for posting the list!!

Cheers, Chris

[gabriele]

jon's voice in open all night sound like post 2000...

[Captain_jovi]

Originally Posted by Suojelusperkele

There are some obvious mistakes in that list, like that Why Aren't You Dead? and The Fire Inside would have been recorded in 1994 - they were really both done for Keep The Faith in 1992. The "original demo" of Love Ain't Nothing But A Four Letter Word was done for These Days, and the alleged final version was done for Crush. It also seems strange to me that the band would have recorded I Get A Rush, Someday Just Might Be Tonight and River Runs Dry in 1996, and All I Wanna Do Is You in 1997; the band weren't making any album in 1996, so why would they have even written those songs then (and would Jon have really written crap like I Get A Rush in 1996, he was writing Destination Anywhere then and that was still a good album - plus his voice is nasal and terrible in that song?)? And as far as I know they weren't together at all in 1997, they were all doing solo stuff and after DA Jon was planning to do another solo record; they regrouped in late 1998 and after that started making Crush... so did they just get back together once in '97 to write and record as frivolous song as All I Wanna Do Is You, which was obviously never going to be on any album, and then they went their separate ways again? Strange. My guess is that all those four songs were recorded in 1999 in the Crush sessions.

Because some of the songs you mentioned were simply not band songs. Lately the line has been blurred between solo work and band work and Jon simply included his solo demos in the box set. I get a rush and river runs dry had no band involvment whatsoever, whereas All I wanna do is you did. AIWDIY is proooobably a crush demo and I heavily disagree about Love ain't nothing...to me the original demo sounds KTF'ish or like the early early demos for TD (Prostitute for example) and the second demo is very TD for me. There was a lot of horns on TD era songs, so it'd make sense to me if that's where it's from.

[Iceman]

Originally Posted by Suojelusperkele

How is Prostitute an "early early demo" for These Days, I've never heard about this?

Possibly because it was released on TAALS-single, where it said "TD demo"?

Ice

[Captain_jovi]

Originally Posted by Suojelusperkele

First of all how do you know that they are solo songs and not band songs, it says nothing about that anywhere in the box? Richie has a co-writing credit on Someday Just Might Be Tonight so how can it be a solo song? And considering what a crap song I Get A Rush is and how bad Jon's vocals are, I can't believe it's from '96 - that was the time when he could still write songs and sing clearly.

And I will strictly disagree about Love Ain't Nothing But A Four Letter Word. Listen to the song carefully, it's very obvious that the first one is These Days and the second Crush, I don't know how anyone could think differently about that. There's the same sound than in Wedding Day in the chorus, I think it's keyboards or something, the soft drumming is similar to These Days era, Jon's lyrics are VERY These Days style, and the song sounds melancholy as in the These Days style. What other These Days song than Damned has horns? With the other later version, Jon's bad vocals, sloppy production sound and the fact that they completely watered down Jon's great lyrics and the whole song with the horns, the female singers and making it sound happier reveal that it's a Crush song. Basically they destroyed the song, and that alone tells that it's from the Crush sessions.

How is Prostitute an "early early demo" for These Days, I've never heard about this?

I'll go one by one:

1) I never said "Someday just might be tonight" was a solo song. Any song with Richie as a co-writer is obviously a band track. That's not to say anything without him isn't, but you know what I mean. The answer lies in the Sex Sells demos. A bunch of songs from the box set were intended for Jon's proposed third solo album. You can tell what richie does/does not play on. The lack of his playing/style and harmonies are a good indicator. Bobbys and richies guitar style are pretty easy to tell apart. Jon had his solo demos put out as band Crush b-sides, the idea of him doing so for the box set isn't that far-fetched.

2) "I thank you" also had horns. Listen to the album and all it's b-sides. Some of the song have a very bar band, Southside Johnny feel. How many Crush songs had ANY horn/brass arrangements? Crush wasn't a very bar band album, it's stripped of just about any bluesy elements, whereas TD was PACKED with them. That and so many songs were written for Crush, why would they dig up a 5 year old demo for inclusion? They had so much material to choose from, I don't think they'd use old stuff whose style doesn't really fit with the current project. and thinking that "Because they destroyed the song, therefore it's from Crush because I don't like that period" is kinda biased

EDIT: Come to think of it, 634-5789 also had horns

3) Prostitute was an early demo because you can tell from the videos that Obie made for AmericanXS, showing really old footage. You can see them recording it, it came from the same sessions that the original Bitter Wine was. You can clearly see due to their hair that it was soon after the KTF tour.

This is all my opinion. I obviously think WAY too far into things.

[Captain_jovi]

Originally Posted by Suojelusperkele

So when were they recorded?? I said that I think that those songs weren't recorded in 1996 and by talking about Jon's intended third solo album you are taking the same position that I have. They may have been recorded in 1998 with the Big Dogs, but I sure as hell don't believe that they - especially I Get A Rush - were recorded in 1996.

(And what, are you saying that the band don't play on any of the 8 Crush B-sides?)

Oh okay. It's a case by case basis. I completely agree, I get a rush is NOt 1996. I really don't have the answers. I just wish it was all labelled better. I have my suspicions for certain songs but have no clue otherwise.

And I'm not saying the band didn't play on ALL of the b-sides. Just certain b-sides were lifted note for note, the exact same version played for the fans in 1998. You can't lose at love, Hush, and Stay.

Originally Posted by Suojelusperkele

They dug up a five year old demo because they had a great song and they wanted to destroy it. Now seriously I don't think they ever really intended to put LANBAFLW on Crush, but that song had been left unfinished in the These Days sessions, they remembered it later and thought they'd work on it a little, do some experiment and see what comes up. And what happened was that they watered down a great melancholy These Days era song. I don't know about their motives but just by listening to them it's obvious the other is TD, the other Crush. Listen to them more carefully; the vocals, the keyboard sound in the chorus, the lyrics are TD style in the first song, the melancholy vs. happy mood etc. It is plain to see.

I still don't buy it but I dont think either one of us is going to change the others mind. I'll defintely give it a listen tonight with your words in mind, but the second version keeps screaming These Days to me. [/QUOTE]

Originally Posted by Suojelusperkele

I have never heard of this, American XS videos or whatever, can you tell more about them or where can I see those videos?

AmericanXS was a service started around the time of the box set, a better way to get tickets to see the band, exclusive content etc. At least that was the original idea. 10 bucks a year. All we ended up getting was a couple of BJ tv's and a handful of "Exclusive tracks" Anyways there were a few vintage vidoes of the band in the studio circa TD.

As far as tracks I'm 80 percent sure don't include the band on and are just ones Jon did alone:

These arms are open all night
I get a rush
Last Chance train
Shut up and kiss me
Crazy Love
River Runs Dry
and MAYBE Temptation

I have various reasons why I think these don't include the band.

[Captain Walrus]

I agree with Matt .... the finished version of Four Letter Word sounds like nothing on Crush, and is far more akin to Damned and Something For The Pain. Damned especially because of the horns. And saying that it must be from Crush because you don't like it is horrendous logic.

[BonJovi1988-1992Mark]

So does - Starting All Over Again

Have the 90s vocals or 00s?

[bjcrazycpa]

Originally Posted by BonJovi1988-1992Mark

So does - Starting All Over Again

Have the 90s vocals or 00s?

Obie said that this is the off the floor vocal (that's why it's so raw) so definitely the 90's.

deb

[BonJovi1988-1992Mark]

Cheers bjcrazycpa!

Man i hope they release another set with sessions from 80s in particular the New Jersey era:

Rosie(Bon Jovi version) , Does anybody really fall in love anymore , Love is war.